CAPITAL IMPROVEMENTS COMMITTEE

200 E. Wells Street City of Milwaukee Milwaukee, Wisconsin 53202 Meeting Minutes CAPITAL IMPROVEMENTS COMMITTEE ALD. JOSEPH DUDZIK, CHAIR Ald. Robert Bauman, Ald. Michael Murphy, Ghassan Korban, Martin Matson, Mark Nicolini, and Mariano Schifalacqua Staff Assistant: Tobie Black, 286-2231; Fax: 286-3456, tblack@milwaukee.gov Fiscal Planning Specialist: Kathleen Brengosz, 286-3926, kbreng@milwaukee.gov Thursday, July 7, 2011 9:00 AM Room 301-B, City Hall Meeting called to order at 9:05 a.m. Members Present: 4- Ghassan Korban, Michael Daun (W. Martin Morics Alternate), Mark Nicolini, Ald. Joseph Dudzik Excused: 3- Gerard Froh (Ald. Murphy Alternate), Ald. Robert Bauman, and Mariano Schifalacqua Also in attendance: Kathy Brengosz, Fiscal Planning Specialist, City Clerk's Office Venu Gupta, Facilities Director, Department of Public Works 1. Review and approval of the minutes of the June 15, 2011 meeting. Minutes were approved as written. 2. Presentation of the Parking Facilities Condition Report. Individuals appearing: Venu Gupta, Department of Public Works Sean Schutten, Department of Public Works-Parking Operations Cindy Angelos, Department of Public Works-Parking Operations Mr. Schutten gave a PowerPoint presentation on the Facilities Condition Assessment Program for Parking Structures (please see the attachment "Parking Condition Report PowerPoint" to Common Council file 101154"). Mr. Schutten also presented a summary of the parking structure at 2nd and Plankinton (please see the attachment "2011 FCAP- Parking 2nd and Plankinton" to Common Council file 101154") Ald. Dudzik asked how city determines that it has a major problem when it sees a crack in a parking structure. Mr. Gupta said that after the incident at the O'Donnell Park Parking Structure in which a teenager was killed, the Mayor asked the Department of Public Works to thoroughly inspect all the city-operated parking City of Milwaukee Page 1 CAPITAL IMPROVEMENTS Meeting Minutes July 7, 2011 COMMITTEE structures. He said that at the MacArthur Square parking structure, there were some panels that pose a higher risk than columns. Mr. Gupta said that the city was already proactive in removing any deteriorating panels. Mr. Gupta said that the decision was made to remove the remaining panels to prevent future deterioration. The inspections revealed no imminent risks at any of the structures, and the structures were found to be safe. Ald. Dudzik said that he appreciates the fact that DPW identifies cracks in parking structures, but he said that DPW should do more in the way of evaluating cracks. Mr. Gupta said that the department does go further than just inspections for cracks in the structures. He says that the department will ask specialists to do more in-depth inspections if the general inspections reveal areas of concern. Ald. Dudzik asked if the Facilities Condition Index is adequate for evaluating the structures that are more ornate or intricate. Mr. Gupta said that different facilities may require different ways to look at the condition assessment index. He said that the department spends more time capturing the actual condition of the structure, and condition index is a relative term. Mr. Gupta suggested working with the Budget Office and the Comptroller's Office to determine if there is a nationwide standard for the indexes that governments are using. He said that the city has a relatively good index and that over the years, Parking Operations has funded the repairs in a timely fashion, which means that the structures are in good condition. Ms. Angelos added that prior to the year 2000, maintenance was done on parking garages in response to problems. Since the year 2000, the city has done a significant amount of preventive maintenance on the parking facilities. She said that the facilities group examines the garages, the structural engineering group examines the structures every two years, and before each capital budget, the department performs reinspections to determine whether the money that has been put into the six-year capital plan is still needed or if it could be allocated to something else that is a higher priority. Ald. Dudzik asked about the leasing agreement for 1000 N. Water St. He mentioned that in the past there were issues regarding whether the city was getting the best cooperative deal from the owner of the building. Ms. Angelos said that there is a working relationship with the owner of the office tower and that the department has asked him to replace the roof of the parking structure. Mr. Korban asked about non-destructive testing methods that are applied to the structures. Mr. Schutten said that those testing methods are mostly visual, non-invasive inspections observing the cracks and any wear and tear. Mr. Gupta also said that x-ray techniques are performed by specialists to detect failures in rebar or other elements in the concrete. He said that this process was used by the department to determine that some rebar had failed due to corrosion in the Lower Parking structure of 841 N. Broadway. Mr. Daun asked about the safety checks that were performed on the garages after the tragedy at the County facility and asked for clarification about the statement that most, not all, of the city's parking facilities are safe. Mr. Gupta clarified that all the parking structures can be considered safe, not just some of them. Mr. Daun asked if there are any major deferred maintenance issues that might result in major investments in parking structures in the near future. Mr. Schutten said that everything has been planned and nothing appears to be a surprise at this time. Mr. Daun also asked if there are any peaks in spending that stand out in the next six years. Ms. Angelos said that in the next several years, the department is spending up to about 1.3 to 1.4 million dollars in costs for the five structures and that the department tries to avoid spikes in spending. If a project is scheduled over a two-year City of Milwaukee Page 2 CAPITAL IMPROVEMENTS Meeting Minutes July 7, 2011 COMMITTEE period, the money spent will be divided equally over the years so there will not be the peaks and valleys with regard to spending. Mr. Daun asked about leasing parking structures to private parties. Ms. Angelos said that the city is not considering leasing to a private party. She used the deterioration that was allowed to happen at MacArthur Square by the lessee as an example of a reason not to do so. She said that there are no sales currently pending and that the owner of the 1000 N. Water office tower has first right of refusal if the city were to accept an offer from another party. Although the building owner has expressed interest in buying the structure in the past, he has not submitted an offer that was close to what the city believes is an acceptable price. Ald. Dudzik asked about the possibility of redeveloping MacArthur Square. Mr. Korban said that there were no plans for any projects in the near future. 3. Presentation of the Sewer Condition Report. Individuals appearing: Tim Thur, Department of Public Works-Environmental Engineering Dick Wanta, Executive Director, Wisconsin Underground Contractors Association Mr. Thur gave a PowerPoint presentation on the Sewer Maintenance Fund (please see the attachment "Sewer Condition Report PowerPoint" to Common Council file 101154). Mr. Thur discussed the schedule for sewer replacement from 2001-2011. He said that the amount of miles of sewer that can be addressed in a year has been increased due to an emphasis on rehabilitation instead of replacement. He said that the 29-mile replacement cycle can be maintained by doing half of the rehabilitation with the cured-in-place process as well as the open-cut work in the six-year maintenance program. Mr. Daun asked for an explanation of the cured-in-place technique for rehabilitating existing sewer lines. Mr. Thur explained that resin is put on a felt tube that is pulled into the pipe. Steam heat or hot water is then used to set the resin, which forms a hard shell inside the sewer pipe. The pressure of the water and the steam pushes the new liner out against the existing sewer pipe. He said that the process can be performed above ground through manholes or through a small shaft. Ald. Dudzik asked how much of the diameter of the pipe is lost on a pipe when the lining takes place. Mr. Thur said that in smaller pipes, less than a quarter of an inch is lost. In the larger pipes, about three inches in diameter of the pipe is lost, but the smoothness of the liner as compared to the roughness of the concrete offsets the lost of the diameter of the pipe. Mr. Thur also said that the lining eliminates joints that catch debris that could lead to clogged sewers and helps prevent open joints in the pipes. Mr. Thur then discussed the total sewer mileage of the three types of sewers, Combined, Sanitary and Storm. He said that there are 2,448 total miles of sewer in the city, the majority of which is Sanitary and Storm and that the average useful life of a sewer is 90 years. Ald. Dudzik asked how long it would take to replace all of the sewers. Mr. Thur said that it would take about 95 years to replace all of the existing sewers. If the replacement rate stayed at 17.2 miles per year, there would be a steady increase in the amount of sewers that were over 90 years old. In ten years time, over 400 miles of sewer would reach the age of 90 years old or more. Mr. City of Milwaukee Page 3 CAPITAL IMPROVEMENTS Meeting Minutes July 7, 2011 COMMITTEE Nicolini asked that for budget presentation purposes a chart be generated using the planned future rate of 29 miles per year for sewer replacement. Mr. Thur said that this could be done. He then showed a slide that illustrated the breakdown of the sewer system by age of the pipes. Mr. Thur explained how the department determines which sewers will enter the capital program and said that the pipes are examined by closed-circuit television and rated on various factors with a ratings sheet. He also said that backwater studies are performed after large events and pipes are examined in areas that experience a lot of basement backups. If a sewer pipe needs to be replaced in an area that is going through repaving, the department attempts to do sewer replacement so the area will not have to be disturbed again. Mr. Thur discussed the Sewer Exam Rating Sheet and how it is used by engineers to assess the condition of the sewers. After an examination, point values are assigned to the pipes based on the age of the pipes, the condition of the pipes and how many backwater incidents have occurred in the area. If sewers have an Index Rating of less than 65, they are considered for replacement or rehabilitation. Ald. Dudzik asked about the spike in sewer replacement in the last few years and asked if it was a result of stimulus dollars from the federal government. Mr. Thur said that in 2009 about 16 million dollars in stimulus funds allowed the city to increase the rate of replacement. Ald. Dudzik then asked how many miles the department examines on a yearly basis. Mr. Thur said that the department examines about 200-250 miles of sewer per year. Mr. Nicolini asked what the unit of analysis is for examining sewers. Mr. Thur said that a segment is used as a unit of analysis and that a segment is generally considered to be manhole to manhole. However, sometimes a greater area is examined. Mr. Nicolini asked the question: in cases in which a minor portion of a segment of sewers that is generally performing well is found to need repairing, will the segment will be repaired instead of replaced through an O and M maintenance project? Mr. Thur said that if there is a segment of five to ten feet of the sewer that needs repairing, it will be repaired instead of the whole line being replaced. Mr. Korban added that the department has point repair contracts in which short segments are replaced in-house or by contractors. Mr. Daun said that bond rating agencies look at rates and planned increases with regard to sewer replacement. He said that if the chart showing sewer lengths needing to be rehabilitated is redone with a replacement rate of 29 miles per year, the chart will show that the city's efforts can compound positively over time. The chart can be used as a simple presentation to show that the city is doing its share and not putting off the issues pertaining to network preservation until the future. Mr. Nicolini added that based on the city's current assumptions, in order to achieve the replacement rate of 29 miles per year, for at least the next six years there will need to be a six-percent increase in the Sewer Maintenance Fee and the Stormwater Fee. Essentially, in twelve years, these fees would double. He also said that the city may be able to moderate the rates after the first six years. Mr. Daun asked what the rationale was for the amount of combined sewers that were built since 1985. Mr. Thur said that the number reflects the amount of existing combined sewers that needed to be replaced due to age. He said that the combined sewer system is not being expanded. Mr. Daun then asked how the department determines that a sewer cannot be relined. Mr. Thur said that the department looks at the condition of the sewer and if the sewer is hydraulically too small to be lined, is collapsing too far or losing shape or sags and moves back and forth, lining would not City of Milwaukee Page 4 CAPITAL IMPROVEMENTS Meeting Minutes July 7, 2011 COMMITTEE be appropriate. Mr. Nicolini said that at the last Finance and Personnel Committee meeting, the committee approved a transfer of an additional one million dollars to offset the increased amount of inlet and outlet replacement that followed an increased paving program. He asked if that would be a continuing input into the capital program. Mr. Thur said if the city continues to get large storm events, he does not know if the department will ever be able to catch up using only O and M funding. Ald. Dudzik asked if manhole rehabilitation is part of the Sewer Maintenance Fund and if the department reports on the number of manholes that are rehabilitated. Mr. Thur said that the department does not report how many miles of sewer have manholes that are rehabilitated, but the cost for the work is part of the Sewer Maintenance Fund. He said that there is a Sewer Maintenance account as well as an Infiltration and Inflow account, and the cost of manhole rehabilitation comes from the I&I account. Ms. Brengosz asked about the 90 year life expectancy of a traditional sewer and the 50 year life expectancy of a relined sewer. She asked if the department keeps track of how many sewers are lined as opposed to being replaced. She also asked if a relined sewer is considered a new sewer or if it is still considered an old sewer. Mr. Thur said that the department does keep track in a database the sewers that have been relined and when they were relined. He said that this allows the department to determine whether a sewer may have a shorter life cycle than another sewer. Ms. Brengosz asked if this meant that the department can determine what percentage of the sewer system may have a shorter lifespan. Mr. Thur answered yes and said that the industry is hesitant to say that a relined sewer will last 100 years. He also said that as time goes on, technology will allow for an expectation of a lifespan of more than 50 years for a relined sewer. Mr. Nicolini asked if the sewer work required under the sanitary sewer stipulation with the state had been completed and what kind of reporting of progress must be made to the state. Mr. Thur said that there were two parts to the stipulation. The work that was required of Milwaukee specifically has been completed. The other part of the stipulation that applies to all the 28 communities included manhole rehabilitation, which requires the city to inspect and replace manholes in a five-year cycle. He said that there is no time frame for completing this work, so the work will be continued until the stipulation goes away. With regard to reporting progress, Mr. Thur said that the city submits a compliance maintenance and operations report to both the Metropolitan Milwaukee Sewerage District and the Department of Natural Resources which includes an update on how much work has been performed. Mr. Nicolini asked Mr. Thur if the department has identified areas where there might be some efficiencies gained through intergovernmental service sharing, such as combined or joint contracting. Mr. Thur answered that the city has joined with other communities over the years for particular projects, but he is not aware of anything done through a joint contract. Mr. Nicolini said that doing work through joint contracting is effective in reducing unit costs. Mr. Nicolini said that there have been examples of some Midwestern cities undergoing planned shrinkage of the sewer system in which certain areas of the city are being selected for disinvestment in public works due to a reduction in the population. With respect to the sewer system, if this scenario were to develop in the City of Milwaukee, Mr. Nicolini asked if it would be practical to plan for capping off segments of the system. Mr. Thur said it would depend on what area was affected by population reduction as some sewer systems are ten acres in size and others are City of Milwaukee Page 5 CAPITAL IMPROVEMENTS Meeting Minutes July 7, 2011 COMMITTEE 1000 acres in size. Mr. Wanta said that he believes that there should be more separation of the combined sewer, which the city is doing, and that the older infrastructure under new construction downtown should be examined closely. He also said that the association is a proponent of sewer separation because if the amount of inflow that goes into the combined sewer can be reduced, there is less need to treat water. Mr. Wanta said that there needs to be more discussion about lateral reconstruction. He also said that there is an opportunity for workers in the inner city to learn how to do the work for separating the combined sewer system. This would enable them to replace an aging workforce. Ald. Dudzik asked if Mr. Wanta is in support of the idea of joint efforts between municipalities for sewer maintenance. Mr. Wanta said that the Association would like to be an ally in encouraging the joint efforts between municipalities. Mr. Brengosz asked if any of the contractors in Southeastern Wisconsin are using the spiral wound technology to rehabilitate sewer lines. Mr. Thur said that he has not seen a lot of use of the spiral-wound technology and that the concern with this technology is that it creates a very long joint on which debris could catch. He also said that the city will not want to take the chance with a new technology given the affordable price of cured in-place technology. Mr. Wanta said that he is not aware of other municipalities that use spiral-wound technology instead of cured in-place. Since the state has reduced the funding for sewer rehabilitation projects, Mr. Wanta asked if the city would be willing to approach foundations to obtain funding for municipal projects which would also help solve the problem of high unemployment in the city. Ald. Dudzik said that it could be discussed at a later time in a different venue. Ald. Dudzik asked Mr. Thur if the city did something similar to capping or shutting down portions of the system in certain areas, such as some large industrial sites. Mr. Thur said that he does not recall offhand, but it is possible that the department did put in a smaller system if the land use in the area had changed. Ald. Dudzik said that in the area of 27th Street and North Avenue, he recalls that the city let the sewer system lay fallow for so long that the city found pesticides in the soil when it went in to repair and replace sewer lines. Mr. Thur said that even if sewers in the 27th and North area are not very active, they have to be kept in place because they serve as the outlet to adjacent areas that were active. 4. Set next agenda. The next meeting is scheduled for July 27th at 9:00 a.m. Milwaukee Water Works and Bike Facilities will be giving condition reports. Ald. Dudzik would also like to look at the debt level at the next meeting to see if it is being used appropriately. Meeting adjourned at 10:25 a.m. Staff Assistant Tobie Black This meeting can be viewed in its entirety through the City's Legislative Research Center at http://milwaukee.legistar.com/calendar. City of Milwaukee Page 6 CAPITAL IMPROVEMENTS Meeting Minutes July 7, 2011 COMMITTEE City of Milwaukee Page 7