Finance Committee
Regular MeetingNashua, NH · September 17, 2014
Minutes
REPORT OF THE FINANCE COMMITTEE
SEPTEMBER 17, 2014
A meeting of the Finance Committee was held on Wednesday, September 17, 2014, at 7:00 p.m. in the
Aldermanic Chamber.
Alderman-at-Large Daniel T. Moriarty, Vice Chair, presided.
Members of the Committee present: Alderman-at-Large David W. Deane
Alderman Ken Siegel
Alderman-at-Large Jim Donchess
Alderman Paul M. Chasse, Jr.
Members not in Attendance: Mayor Donnalee Lozeau
Alderwoman Pamela T. Brown
Also in Attendance: Officer Adam Anderson, NPD
Ms. Karen Smith, Business Manager, NPD
PUBLIC COMMENT - None
COMMUNICATIONS
From: Mayor Donnalee Lozeau
Re: Emergency Purchase of a Replacement for the No. 2 Bar Rack Carriage
MOTION BY ALDERMAN SIEGEL TO ACCEPT AND PLACE ON FILE
ON THE QUESTION
Alderman Deane
This was $107,463.57 expenditure. It seems like things are running amuck at our treatment plant for some
reason. You need the bar screen to keep the debris out.
MOTION CARRIED
From: John L. Griffin, Chief Financial Officer
Re: Contract Award for FY15 Ammunition Requested by Nashua Police Department
(Value: $67,289)
MOTION BY ALDERMAN SIEGEL TO ACCEPT, PLACE ON FILE AND AWARD THE CONTRACT TO
RILEY’S SPORT SHOP IN THE AMOUNT OF $67,289. FUNDS ARE AVAILABLE IN DEPARTMENT 150,
POLICE DEPARTMENT, GENERAL OPERATING FUND; 61, SUPPLIES AND MATERIALS
ON THE QUESTION
Alderman Chasse
Are these all practice rounds or are they both?
Finance – 09/17/14 Page 2
Officer Adam Anderson, Nashua Police Department
This is our entire ammunition purchase for this fiscal year. Its duty rounds, riffle rounds, and hand gun rounds.
It’s what the officer carries on him and our practice rounds.
Alderman Deane
I had a question on the cover letter to Mr. Berry. Is it usual and customary to have such an extended period of
time for this and is the price locked in for that period as well?
Ms. Karen Smith, Business Manager, NPD
Yes, we have had the price extended in the past, it’s not unusual.
Alderman Deane
So the cost with what we are purchasing this evening as times goes on, we can continue to enjoy that level of
expenditure without seeing any increases?
Ms. Smith
That’s correct. We would have to have another letter to extend it again and that most likely would not happen,
it would be through probably the next state contract.
Alderman Deane
This says August 31, 2017. Is this the usual and customary amount of ammunition that the department buys
on a yearly basis?
Ms. Smith
Yes.
Alderman Deane
So basically that $67,000 we will see for the next couple of years for this amount.
Ms. Smith
Yes but if I could add to that, it just depends on the pricing. If the ammunition goes up, certainly the price is
going to go up. Or, it could depend on what programs they are having, whether they have a different unit that
needs different ammunition so yes, $67,000 is right in the ballpark. Last year we ordered in that range and I
think this year it is about a 15% increase. It just depends what’s going on in the economy and where the
pricing is going to be at but certainly in that ballpark.
Alderman Deane
So these prices are not locked for a couple more years, they are subject to increase?
Ms. Smith
It depends on who has state bid. I would have to check to see when the Riley’s contract expires.
Finance – 09/17/14 Page 3
Alderman Deane
It states here that the effective date of this contract shall be effective present, which is August 13, 2014; which
is the date of the letter through August 31, 2107.
Ms. Smith
Yes, so it definitely would be that period.
Alderman Deane
So they would have the contract but the prices aren’t locked with Riley’s because they have the contract, is that
what you are saying?
Ms. Smith
The price is locked I just didn’t realize that this letter was the State of New Hampshire date. We have had
Riley’s, who has extended the price even after the contract had expired but yes, to answer your question, the
price goes to August 31, 2017; according to the State of New Hampshire contract currently awarded to Riley’s.
Alderman Deane
So we are locked at that price?
Ms. Smith
Yes.
Alderman Chasse
None of these are reloads right?
Officer Anderson
They are not.
MOTION CARRIED
From: John L. Griffin, Chief Financial Officer
Re: Contract for Outside Counsel Related to Broad Street Parkway (Value: $51,750)
MOTION BY ALDERMAN SIEGEL TO ACCEPT, PLACE ON FILE AND AWARD THE CONTRACT TO
ATTORNEY MARK P. HODGDON, FOR AN AMOUNT NOT-TO-EXCEED $51,750. SOURCE OF FUNDING
IS DEPARTMENT 160, PUBLIC WORKS ADMINISTRATION AND ENGINEERING; BOND – CAPITAL
PROJECT FUND; BROAD STREET PARKWAY
ON THE QUESTION
Alderman Deane
I had a question about who the principals of J.K.S. Realty, LLC are. Does anyone know that?
Finance – 09/17/14 Page 4
Attorney Bennett
I don’t know all of the principals but I believe one, however is Mr. Tamposi.
Alderman Chasse
It’s going to pain me but this will be the first time that I will have to vote in favor when the words read “Broad
Street Parkway.” It’s just to try to recoup some of that money.
Alderman Donchess
Where is this property anyway?
Attorney Bennett
It’s going to be, I believe, where the bridge is going across down below. It’s not necessarily a great piece of
property, there’s a lot of wetland and the topography is difficult to build in. That’s one of the reasons that we
were somewhat surprised by the BTLA’s decision because we didn’t think the property could sustain the
amount of development that J.K.S. felt it could; or their engineering at least felt it could.
Alderman Donchess
Is it on the north side of the river over by Fairmount Street?
Attorney Bennett
I believe that’s where the location is. I wasn’t involved in the case and I’m not that familiar with the property.
Alderman Donchess
BTLA is the Board of Land and Tax Appeals?
Attorney Bennett
Correct, they do all of the imminent domain.
Alderman Donchess
How much is the dispute at this point?
Attorney Bennett
Our estimate came in at $1.3 million for the taking and theirs came in at almost $2.9 million so there’s a
difference of about $1.5 million.
Alderman Donchess
From what I am reading, this will be ultimately be a jury trial in the Superior Court, is that correct?
Attorney Bennett
Yes.
Finance – 09/17/14 Page 5
Alderman Donchess
Do you have any sense of when that will get decided?
Attorney Bennett
I believe it will be next spring at the Superior Court level.
Chairman Moriarty
Attorney Bennett, if you currently walk along the road, which we are not supposed to, you go past the section
that they are building those cement pilings where the Nashua River comes in quite close and then there’s a
gigantic sand kingdom, I was wondering if that were the part of the land.
Attorney Bennett
Well you have been at the Broad Street Parkway more than I have. I haven’t even been out there so I really
don’t have a lot of information about where the property is. In its entirety it is about an 11-acre parcel.
MOTION CARRIED
From: John Griffin, Chief Financial Officer
Bruce Codagnone, CIO IT Division Director
William Mansfield, Radio Systems Manager
Re: Citywide Communications – Fiber Optic Cabling
MOTION BY ALDERMAN SIEGEL TO ACCEPT AND PLACE ON FILE
ON THE QUESTION
Alderman Deane
When I read the body of this, when I read the second sentence where it says purchasing order NRO 5-81
provides for the consideration of competitive proposals in a situation where competitive sealed bidding is not
practical. It goes on to state that this particular project is relatively small in size and scope and consists of
running fiber cable and does not require a detailed specification to be written. Even so, if that’s the case then
whether an RFP was written or not, it still could have gone out to bid. It should have gone out to bid. If we use
the rationale that the project was relatively small in size and scope, I still think it really doesn’t fall under 5-81.
That’s just my opinion.
Chairman Moriarty
It’s worth noting that this is a two-part piece of legislation. We will accept and place on file just the
communication and then you guys have to decide whether you want to take the item off the table that we tabled
last time.
Alderman Deane
I believe this memo deals with the rational of the discussion that we had at our last meeting.
Chairman Moriarty
Yes.
Finance – 09/17/14 Page 6
Alderman Deane
It’s from when the issue was raised about the procurement process and this is the answer to the questions that
were raised that was given to us.
Chairman Moriarty
Correct, so you can vote yes to accept it and still vote no to take it off the table if you want.
Alderman Chasse
Why don’t we just not accept this and table it and when we bring the other one back because I have no
intentions the other one up to the table tonight because that’s for the Mayor. If there are any questions, she
would be the one who would have a lot of the answers.
Alderman Siegel
I have to agree with the Chairman. There doesn’t seem to be much harm in accepting this memorandum. We
may decide that it’s not sufficient for us to take the other item off the table because it probably could be fleshed
out. Certainly, Alderman Deane seems to feel that way. We can accept it and then leave the other item on the
table with the provision that what you gave us that we accepted wasn’t acceptable. I know that sounds
unusual.
Alderman Donchess
So, the motion on the floor is simply to accept this and place it on file; is that correct? Not to take action on it?
Chairman Moriarty
Correct.
MOTION CARRIED
UNFINISHED BUSINESS - None
NEW BUSINESS – None
TABLED IN COMMITTEE
From: John L. Griffin, Chief Financial Officer
Re: Citywide Communication – Fiber Optic Cabling (Value: $28,800)
Tabled 9/3/14
DISCUSSION
MOTION BY ALDERMAN SIEGEL THAT THE RULES BE SO FAR SUSPENDED AS TO ACCEPT AND
PLACE ON FILE COMMUNICATIONS RECEIVED AFTER THE AGENDA WAS PREPARED
Finance – 09/17/14 Page 7
ON THE QUESTION
Alderman Siegel
The two items that I would like to have entered into the record are the memorandums that I have handed out to
you in hard copy and that I have sent via e-mail, the first of which is the memorandum from Robert Mack,
Welfare Officer, concerning Welfare Department Housing and Emergency Shelter Assistance and the second
memorandum is from me, Ken Siegel, Alderman Ward 9; subject is the Examination of NFR and NPD Incident
Calls and Costs to 23 Temple Street.
Chairman Moriarty
So, the compound motion very valid by Alderman Siegel is to suspend the rules to accept these two items and
accept these two items and place them of file.
MOTION CARRIED
Chairman Moriarty
Now would be a good time to discuss those two items if you so choose.
Alderman Siegel
The first item is in response to some questions that came up at the previous Finance Committee meeting
regarding what our ability to select places for our less fortunate residents to allow…what discretion do we have
in choosing or directing in some way these residents to places in the city that aren’t safe for them and
potentially are not maintained very well and that the taxpayers of Nashua would probably be better to not be
paying our tax dollars towards. As I read the memo from Mr. Mack, it appears as though we are free to
recommend how we see it and so we have the option to not recommend a place like 23 Temple Street which,
in the other memorandum I will be discussion, I clearly outline the various social costs of responding for the
Nashua Fire Department, the ambulance services, and police. That’s the gist of Mr. Mack’s memorandum
which I received prior to inquiring about the costs of service calls to the fire department and the police
department. In the second memo which I sent out to the full Board this afternoon and which I have made
copies of here tonight, I got information from Nashua Fire & Rescue and the Nashua Police Department about
the incident costs at 23 Temple Street. There was an e-mail sent from our colleague, Alderwoman Brown,
offering us the opportunity to tour 23 Temple Street and apparently, Alderwoman Brown, while she had a prior
commitment and could not make the last two Finance Committee meetings was able to attend a walk through
at 23 Temple Street. Unfortunately, she is not here to share with us whatever wisdom she may have
accumulated in walking through there but it lieu of that, I think you can that there is quite a dramatic difference
between 23 Temple Street, which is the number one incident reported location in the City of Nashua and
number two; almost by a factor of two to three depending on fire rescue or the police department. There’s a
conservative estimate that I have here where I asked Chief Morrissey and Chief Seusing for the cost
associated with sending out a fire department truck and ambulance as well as the cost of a police cruiser to
come by. In here, starting with Nashua Fire Rescue, there were 82 incidents involving only Nashua Fire &
Rescue at 23 Temple. Now, Assistant Chief Steve Gallipeau said that a minimum cost would $182.41 for each
one of those incidents. If the ambulance comes he said its $547.84 plus $9.08 mile. Assuming a conservative
round-trip estimate of 10 miles because of course, if they are not emergencies, they take the long route; we get
a fairly substantial cost on the order of $45,000 in total just for fire rescue and $28,000 approximately for the
police department if you look at the incidents there. The incidents there are figuring out 840 calls just to 23
Temple Street. These are calls that were dispatched automatically, computer aided dispatch. 840 calls to one
single location in Nashua, assuming a minimum of 1 hours’ time and the chief said that every call was different
– some were small and some calls were fairly substantial but that if you consider that it’s dispatching an officer
and the reporting time, it is incredibly conservative to call it 840 hours. At the current contract cost that would
be $26,014 or $27,795 just in hourly labor cost to send an officer there. What we are looking at is on the order
Finance – 09/17/14 Page 8
of $73,000 just from those items alone to this one location and the secondary locations that we have to house
our less fortunate people that are in need of assistance are Lillian’s, the Country Barn and you see that while
there are incidents there, they pale in comparison. My point being is that I believe we can make better choices
as a government for our taxpayers and for our less fortunate citizens and we can do so by not paying money to
anybody to go to 23 Temple Street. It’s clear that the owners of this property don’t seem to be very responsive
because this has historically been the worst property in Nashua. I know that Alderwoman Brown is trying to
advocate after a long slumber of 8 ½ months on the Board of Aldermen. She has decided to advocate initially
for the owner’s of 23 Temple Street rather than our own residents; I choose differently and I’m sorry
Alderwoman Brown isn’t here for what might have been a spirited debate on the relative merits of 23 Temple
Street. I would urge my colleagues as the Record of Expenditures comes up, that for now we certainly have to
let these expenditures go through; they are on-going but in the future, after a few months I suppose, I am not
going to sign a Record of Expenditures that pays money to 23 Temple Street.
Alderman Chasse
Alderman Siegel, I know what you are trying to do and I kind of feel the same way but I read Mr. Mack’s letter
and there’s nowhere in here that says that we, as a Board of Aldermen, have the right to pick and choose
which places that these individuals decide to locate. It does say that they go through a program under the
Greater Nashua Continuum of Care toolkit and it does say in there that if the tenants that we gave the money to
the landlord to, if the tenants have a problem then they should get in touch with the Welfare Department who
gets in touch with the Code Enforcement Department and then the city can hold the check until that building is
back up to code. I don’t see anywhere here where we can say we don’t want to send them. I understand the
problem; that was a very good report you compiled here. I don’t know are we stepping over our bounds here?
I understand your feelings of not wanting to give them the money but I do know that the Code Enforcement
Department recently gave them a carte blanch saying they were up to code. I didn’t attend the walk through, I
haven’t seen it. I don’t think I want to take a walk through, I’m not really interested. I have mixed feelings on
this one.
Alderman Siegel
I appreciate your sentiment. I’m not saying that the Board of Aldermen gets to choose where we send people.
All I am saying is that according to the memorandum from Mr. Mack, our city government has the option for
who they recommend and I would expect that we might, given the circumstances, exercise an option; not “we”
the Board of Aldermen, but “we” collectively as a city government exercise the option to not recommend inferior
housing. I know that I don’t feel right about having people who are unfortunate put into a position where they
may be at risk.
Alderman Chasse
Can you point out where it says that in this memo? I read it twice and I didn’t see that, am I missing
something?
Alderman Siegel
I would point you to the last paragraph “Applicants are informed of local motel establishments that will accept
Welfare Department vouchers.” We have the freedom of not informing them that 23 Temple accepts those
vouchers.
Alderman Chasse
Are you saying that where the Welfare Department works?
Finance – 09/17/14 Page 9
Alderman Siegel
That’s correct.
Alderman Chasse
It’s not the Board of Aldermen, it’s the Welfare Department so I guess the Board of Aldermen would have to sit
down with the Welfare Department and strongly suggest that the Welfare Department doesn’t use 23 Temple
Street. That would probably be the right way to go.
Alderman Siegel
I believe that message has been communicated however; I think that on principle, what we do is we approve or
disapprove the Record of Expenditures. That would be a question I have because as a Finance Committee, I
believe that we can reject expenses where there are other alternatives that are equivalent or better. I believe
that 23 Temple Street could possibly be worse than other alternatives considering the health and safety of our
less fortunate residents. I completely understand that it would be very easy to say that I’m overstepping my
bounds than to say that I am within my rights but this is more of a conscience decision on my part and a pure
economic decision. Why are we rewarding problematic properties?
Alderman Chasse
I don’t think you are overstepping your bounds because I have the same feelings as you do. The only
alternative though is that if you don’t use them and I think they are the biggest one, if there are no rooms, they
allow them to go to a motel for a night and I don’t know what they would get from the Welfare Department.
Motel 6 is probably around $60.00 - $70.00. I think the Welfare Department should come in front of the Board
of Aldermen and let the Board of Aldermen say hey, see if you cannot use that place or use it as a last resort.
You would need all of the numbers.
Attorney Bennett
When Alderman Siegel made his request about information regarding the welfare’s practices for providing
shelter to people, I just worked with Mr. Mack in response so I am quite familiar with at least the information
provided by Mr. Mack. I don’t disagree with Alderman Siegel that when we are providing shelter for people, we
do want to make sure that it is a shelter that is as safe as we can ensure for people. We have many different
standards of housing throughout the city. There are areas where the housing is not in as good of shape as we
would like it be and there are areas that are not as safe as we would like them to be. We have more calls in
certain areas of the city than we do in other areas. The properties that were focused on in Alderman Siegel’s
report, I agree have had a number of visits from both fire and police but I would point out that doesn’t
necessarily reflect the owners. I don’t believe that the police calls were as a result of the owners doing
anything wrong. The owners have responsibility for the condition of the buildings and that’s another issue and I
think you have to separate the two. The Code Department has been working with 23 Temple Street recently.
There was an inspection done and I don’t think it was quite as successful as Alderman Chasse suggested.
There are still some violations however, the life safety code violations which are the top concern, had been
addressed. I haven’t seen the final report yet but that’s my understanding. When we have provided shelter
through the Welfare Department we do not “recommend,” I think the word “recommend” is incorrect. There are
a certain number of establishments which will accept city vouchers. Other methods of payment have been less
successful. We can’t give somebody a credit card or cash so in order to better manage our funds, they had the
voucher system but not establishments will accept vouchers. There are other available resources. We do
have some shelters in the city. They are not necessarily good for certain people. Certain people seem not to
fit in well at shelters and they can’t go there; families in particular. We do need other places for immediate,
temporary shelters. It is my understanding that number is very limited as to who accept a city voucher and
work with the city along those lines. We do, of course, give vouchers to a number of other people who have an
apartment but still need assistance, at least temporarily, to afford where they are living. The Welfare
Finance – 09/17/14 Page 10
Department tries not to be part of the selection process. Maintaining people’s dignity also includes allowing
them to make those choices that we all try to make and that includes where we are going to live. We try to
have people to have that choice when it’s available. I think while these properties surely have any number of
issues, not just with the property but with the area, and sometimes the people, the system that we use is one
that allows people to have a freedom of choice and we do not tell them that they have to go someplace. We do
require in some cases that people go to shelters initially but a lot of times those shelters are filled. I want to
point out that this is not necessarily a selection process in which we have selected these places for any reason.
They self-select by accepting city vouchers. If we start crossing off properties based on police calls or non-
threatening code violations, we might find that we don’t have enough housing or temporary shelters for people
that need it. That’s what I have learned and in the memo it does point out that code does work with welfare to
point out where there are code issues that they feel are safety issues. Either people are told they can’t go
there or when issues come up the people are allowed to hold on their rent and place it in an escrow account
until the problems are taken care of. That’s mostly in the long-term apartments where people are actually
renting.
Chairman Moriarty
You bring up the important issue that we distinguish between the owners taking care of the building versus the
residents causing problems. We would need an RSA in either case to allow us to do any of this but on the one
hand, we would like to discourage owners from misbehaving by withholding payment but on the other hand,
how do you discourage people from misbehaving by withholding payment. We have disorderly, domestic, drug
offense, and theft which brought service but it had nothing to do with the owners but everything to do with the
people living there.
Alderman Donchess
Attorney Bennett, I read in the newspaper about the city doing an inspection with various city people and
documenting a number of different violations, some of which were incredibly disgusting. What is the process
by which…if the city finds a violation of the building or health code, what happens? Does the city issue an
order that they correct that violation?
Attorney Bennett
I assume the process is relatively the same regardless of what department you are talking about. We have
health, fire, building and the way they generally approach it is first it’s on the premise that we want compliance
in the end. Looking for fines don’t necessarily take care of the problem so the first that is done, assuming that it
is not a life threatening violation, they are given a notice of first violation and a reasonable amount of time to
take care of the violation and then there’s a re-inspection done. If it is an immediate life/safety issue they have
the authority to essentially close the structure and prevent people from entering the structure and that has
occurred on occasion for reasons including infestations of animals or insects. The typical violation is not a
life/safety code violation where there is an immediate threat to health. They are given a notice of violation, time
to correct it, and then there’s an inspection. If people are making an effort to correct the problem, we will work
with them. Sometimes it comes down to a money issue because it might be a major repair. We find that if we
work with them, eventually the problem does get corrected. We are trying to get compliance using the carrot
and not the stick all of the time.
Alderman Donchess
Based upon what I have read and heard here in the Aldermanic Chamber, there is a long history of violations
at 23 Temple Street and assuming that is correct, there doesn’t seem to be a financial inability to take care of
the building in the sense that there are 100+ plus units there and the rental for a room is around $100 a week
which means if they are fully occupied they are bringing in $10,000 per week or $40,000 per month; and $5
million per year and I don’t even think the building is worth $5 million. There’s a lot of money coming out of this
building for whoever owns it, at least based upon that analysis and there seem to be constant violations over
Finance – 09/17/14 Page 11
there. In a case where you have a building where you know the owner can or it seems apparent that the owner
can afford to fix the building up and correct violations without the city having to send 10 inspectors over there
and we know that there are multiple violations over and over and over again, why in that situation do we not
take a more aggressive approach and seek fines and the like in order to try to bring about overall compliance
with building, health, &and safety codes.
Attorney Bennett
I believe they have taken that approach. I’ve been involved in several meetings over the last few months with
code enforcement, fire, and police where we have met to discuss the problems and to set up this regular
inspection schedule to stay on top of these problems and require them to have the problems fixed. We have
shut down specific rooms in the building on occasion when required and that has a financial impact. A number
of the life/safety code violations and I’m not sure how many of them but there’s a fair amount of damage
caused to the sprinkler system by the people who live there. My understanding is that they go and they find the
sprinklers damaged, the fire alarms damaged; it’s not necessarily due to a failure to maintain, it’s due to
outright damage. A lot of the conditions that you alluded to, the nasty conditions there are not necessarily
because the building isn’t being maintained as much as it is some of the residents causing the mess and
damage in there. That is ultimately going to be the responsibility of the owner to clean it up and that’s what
code, fire, and the police have been working at. They have gone through every room in that building at the last
inspection. That’s not the typical inspection of a building. The Mayor requested code to target that building to
make sure that these on-going problems were addressed.
Alderman Donchess
I am not suggesting that Code Enforcement didn’t do a good job, it appeared that they did. They went in and
found all kinds of stuff. I’m just saying if we continue to inspect and there continues to be violations, should the
city pursue a more aggressive, legal stance and seek fines against the owner which maybe will create greater
motivation to keep things in line. If the residents are causing some of these problems which undoubtedly they
are, maybe the owner should kick the people out who are causing the problems. I’m advocating for a more
aggressive approach. I applaud the code people for finding all of the violations they did but I think our patience
should not be infinite.
Chairman Moriarty
It’s certainly a complicated issue. We might want to consider having a dedicated meeting on this. I mean, what
can we do as a Finance Committee?
Alderman Siegel
First of all, and it’s very important to address this, it’s about helping the people that are there or they are looking
for assistance. We are focusing on the condition of the building and the landlord but the fact that there is a lot
of crime there is entirely germane to the thrust of my issue which is that we have unfortunate people and we
are housing them in a place where they are not safe in my estimation based on hard data which I have taken
the time to get in front of us. The fact that the residents that are there are or are not engaged in crime or some
activity that is negative is directly impactful on our decision about whether it not it makes sense to place people
there.
Alderman Deane
The one thing when Attorney Bennett was talking about the code and the health department working with these
folks and giving them warnings, it states here under A400-8; Disbursements under B-1 “can be issued payment
the vendor, which is the landlord, must be on the city’s vendor file and the property must be in compliance with
the current land/use controls statutes and ordinances.” If multiple violations are being found then is there
another section in this book that describes a process by which the health department…
Finance – 09/17/14 Page 12
Attorney Bennett
If you look at our code, the reference there is to be in compliance with our land/use code.
Alderman Deane
It says land/use control statutes and ordinances. Does that cover just land/use ordinances or ordinances in
general because the word “and” is front of it? I understand the rationale behind what code enforcement and
the health department does. I know this much, our fire department rules with an iron fist. You can have
everything else signed off on but if there are life/safety issues, there is no wiggle room; the fire department will
just shut the place down. I understand that the issues over there are not all about building depreciation; it’s
about vandalism and things of that nature. I’m just wondering how they came up with the process of working
with these landlords when the ordinances specifically state how things are supposed to be. Is there anything
within here that gives them the authority to carry their process out or is it just a policy that they have put
together to work with the landlords? How does that work?
Attorney Bennett
Are you speaking about the Welfare Department now? Who do you mean by “they?”
Alderman Deane
The code enforcement and the health department. If they go over there and they find the facility riddled with
violations, the way I read this is “no payment is to be issued to the vendor if they are not in compliance with the
land/use control statutes and ordinances.” If they are not in compliance, how and why are they being paid?
Why is the Welfare Department offering vouchers for people to go live there in they are not up to snuff.
Alderman Chasse
I’d like to make a recommendation. I think this should go to the Human Affairs Committee where they can
handle this because it falls under their jurisdiction and not the Finance Committee. Mr. Mack should attend and
Mr. Nelson from the Code Enforcement Department could also attend to answer questions.
Alderman Deane
That’s a brilliant idea.
MOTION BY ALDERMAN DONCHESS TO REFER THE TWO COMMUNICATIONS TO THE HUMAN
AFFAIRS COMMITTEE REGARDING ALL FACILITIES THAT ACCEPT HOUSING AND EMERGENCY
ASSISTANCE
ON THE QUESTION
Alderman Deane
I think it would also be helpful to send copies of these two memos to the Human Affairs Committee as well for
their review.
Alderman Donchess
Of course.
MOTION CARRIED
Finance – 09/17/14 Page 13
Alderman Donchess
I wanted to say that I understand that the Mayor vetoed the open government reform that the Board of
Aldermen passed at the last meeting; the one that requires that the Finance Committee be informed when a
police or fire department purchase request comes in. I’m disappointed in the veto. I as well as the City Charter
consider the Board of Aldermen to be an equal partner with the Mayor and city government and we cannot
exercise our responsibilities under the City Charter and our responsibilities as the Finance Committee unless
we are informed about what’s going on. I consider all of the members of the Finance Committee to be
responsible adults and Aldermen who can exercise sound discretion on behalf of the taxpayers of the City of
Nashua so it does no harm to inform us about what’s going on and I hope that the Board will consider that and
override the veto.
RECORD OF EXPENDITURES
MOTION BY ALDERMAN SIEGEL THAT THE FINANCE COMMITTEE HAS COMPLIED WITH THE CITY
CHARTER AND ORDINANCES PERTAINING TO THE RECORD OF EXPENDITURES FOR THE PERIOD
AUGUST 29, 2014 TO SEPTEMBER 11, 2014
ON THE QUESTION
Alderman Deane
I had asked about transfer sheets being put on the financial services link on the city’s website. I will talk to Mr.
Griffin after the meeting but I was wondering if that will take place because I can’t seem to find them.
MOTION CARRIED
PUBLIC COMMENT - None
POSSIBLE NON-PUBLIC SESSION
ADJOURNMENT
MOTION BY ALDERMAN CHASSE TO ADJOURN
MOTION CARRIED
The Finance Committee meeting was adjourned at 7:57 p.m.
Alderman Ken Siegel
Committee Clerk
Board of Aldermen
City of Nashua
229 Main Street Ken Siegel
Nashua, NH 03061-2019 Alderman, Ward 9
(603) 589-3030
TO: Board of Aldermen
FROM: Ken Siegel, Alderman, Ward 9
DATE: September 17, 2014
SUBJ: Examination of NFR and NPD Incident Calls and Costs to 23 Temple Street
Colleagues,
This memorandum is for distribution at the Finance Committee meeting of September 17, 2014. It is a
rollup of some research work that was done by the Nashua Police and Fire and Rescue Departments. I
would like to thank both Chief Seusing and Chief Morrissey and their staff for the very helpful and timely
responses to my requests for information.
Included is a breakdown of incident reports for 23 Temple Street and some other properties in Nashua
that we may use for temporary housing assistance. I have also included some incident cost estimates
provided by NPD and NFR. It is my contention that this property has such a substantial number of
incidents that it is not appropriate for temporary housing for our less fortunate citizens. It is also
completely inappropriate for the taxpayers of Nashua to be rewarding the owners of this property with
our tax dollars. I believe we have better options for temporary housing.
Since our colleague, Alderwoman Brown, has sent an email to the Telegraph as well as the Board of
Aldermen regarding a potential visit to this location on behalf of the owners of 23 Temple I am including
that here as well at the end of this memorandum.
Nashua Police Statistics:
Year Comparison (September 1, 2013 through August 31, 2014)
Country Barn
Motel (507 Lillian’s Motel Laton House (28 23 TEMPLE
BROAD (188 CONCORD RAILROAD ST Grand
Reason Text ST) ST) ST) Total
911 HANGUP 1 2 7 10
911 HANGUP-OPEN LINE 1 1
ABANDONED MV 2 2
ACCIDENT 1 2 2 1 6
ACCIDENT HIT & RUN 1 1 2
Activated Alarm 1 1
AMBULANCE CALL 13 9 62 57 141
ANIMAL CALL 2 1 1 4
ARREST 1 1 2
ASSAULT 4 11 10 25
ATTEMPT TO LOCATE 18 5 7 26 56
Box Alarm 2 12 14
BURGLARY 1 7 8
CHECK CONDITIONS 16 5 23 52 96
CHECK WELL BEING 3 1 3 20 27
COMMUNITY POLICING 4 22 55 81
CRIMINAL MISCHIEF 1 1 3 4 9
CRIMINAL THREATENING 1 1 2
CRIMINAL TRESPASS 1 1 4 11 17
CUSTOMER DISPUTE 2 2
DEBRIS IN ROADWAY 1 1
DELIVER MESSAGE 6 1 3 10
DISABLED VEHICLE 2 2
DISORDERLY 2 12 23 37
DISORDERLY - MALE 1 1
DISORDERLY - PERSON 1 1
DISORDERLY - PERSONS 1 1 2
DISORDERLY FEMALE 1 1
DISORDERLY GROUP 1 3 1 5
DISORDERLY JUVENILES 1 1 2
DISORDERLY JUV'S 1 1
DISORDERLY MALE 1 4 5
DISORDERLY MALES 1 3 4
DISORDERLY MOTOR VEHICLE 1 1 2
DISORDERLY PERSON 1 1 2
DISTURBANCE 1 7 8 16
DOMESTIC 25 2 5 36 68
DOMESTIC/VERBAL 1 1
DRUG OFFENSE 1 5 6
FAMILY NEIGHBOR DISPUTE 1 1
FIRE CALL 1 4 5
FIREWORKS 1 1
FOLLOW UP 21 3 29 98 151
FOUND PROPERTY 2 2
FRAUD 2 2
GIVE ADVICE 4 2 8 19 33
GIVE ASSISTANCE 4 2 4 21 31
HARASSMENT 2 5 11 18
INVESTIGATION 2 3 5
KEEP THE PEACE 10 3 9 22
LANDLORD TENANT DISPUTE 1 2 3 6
LEWD INDECENT EXPOSURE 1 1 2
LOST PROPERTY 1 1
LOUD GROUP 1 1
LOUD MUSIC 1 1 2
LOUD NOISE 3 2 9 14
LOUD NOISE MUSIC 7 2 13 39 61
MISSING JUVENILE 1 1
MOTOR VEHICLE STOP 5 15 2 38 60
NEIGHBOR DISPUTE 1 7 10 18
OVERDOSE 2 10 12
PAPERWORK 8 5 9 16 38
PARKING COMPLAINT 6 1 7
POLICE INFORMATION 3 3 2 3 11
POSSIBLE ASSAULT 1 1
POSSIBLE WITNESS TAMPERING 1 1
ROOMMATE DISPUTE 1 1
SEARCH WARRANT 1 1
SEX OFFENDER CHECK 4 7 11
Sex Offender Registration 2 2
SEX OFFENSES 1 1
SUBJECT STOP 2 25 90 117
SUICIDAL 1 3 4
SUICIDAL ATTEMPT 1 1
SUICIDAL MALE 1 1 2 4
SUICIDAL SUBJECT 1 1
SUPPLEMENTAL INFORMATION 8 8
SUSPICIOUS ACTIVITY 2 2
SUSPICIOUS PERSON 2 2
SUSPICIOUS VEHICLE 1 1
THEFT 6 1 4 28 39
THEFT FROM M/V 1 1
THEFT-OF SERVICES 2 2
TRANSPORT 3 3
TRESPASS 1 2 3
UNCONTROLLABLE CHILD 1 1 2
UNDESIRABLE 4 9 16 31 60
VERIFY VIN 1 1 2
VICTIM NOTIFICATION DV RELATED 1 1
VIOLATION OF BAIL CONDITIONS 1 1
VIOLATION OF RESTRAINING ORDER 1 1 2
WARRANT 1 1
Grand Total 211 79 323 840 1,453
Chief Seusing has said that some of these calls require a lot of effort and some much less but a very
conservative estimate would be an hour of an officers time for each call including writing up any
necessary reports. I asked about 23 Temple Street in particular. From Chief Seusing via email:
A VERY conservative look at a cost associated with responding to 23 Temple St. would be based on 1 hour of our
time per call. 23 Temple St. had 840 CAD (computer aided dispatch) calls listed to that location. The straight
hourly rate of a Master Patrolman (7 year officer) is $30.97
840 hours X $30.97 = $26,014
Again, a very rough/conservative cost associated with 23 Temple St. On a side note that hourly rate is based on
the expired contract. The new rate, once in effect for the current fiscal year would be $33.09 X 840 =$27,795.60.
Note that the above estimate does not include anything but straight salary costs. It is also interesting to
note that, according to the Chief in a follow up phone call, the 840 CAD calls were almost 3 times higher
than the next highest location in the city (The Laton House Hotel).
Via email from Chief Morrissey of Nashua Fire and Rescue Department:
Alderman Siegel,
I checked the NFR call volume to some specific addresses for the past year.
The information has two numbers one showing responses that involved NFR units (NFIRS) and the
other number adds incidents that involved AMR without NFR support.
Call Analysis Period: 09-01-2013 to 09-01-2014:
Temple St Hotel 23 Temple St – NFIRS: 82 All Calls: 128
Temple St Hotel 29 Temple St – NFIRS: 18 All Calls: 27
Laton House 28 Railroad Square – NFIRS: 32 All Calls: 62
Lillians 188 Concord St – NFIRS: 7 All Calls: 14
Country Barn 507 Broad St – NFIRS: 13 All Calls: 33
Motel 6 2 Progress Ave – NFIRS: 19 All Calls 29
Data is from Fire Dispatch call logs.
Chief M.
I asked about the cost of these calls and received the following information from Assistant Chief Steve
Galipeau
Alderman Siegel,
Here is the breakdown of the cost for a single unit (pumper) response. The base for this response
would be $182.41 and the base cost for AMR appears to be $547.84 plus mileage ($9.08 per). If you
have any questions please call me.
Assistant Chief Steven Galipeau
For 23 Temple Street we had 82 calls just involving NFR. We had 46 involving just the AMR service. The
costs associated with this in the most conservative case using the supplied figures would be 82*182.41=
$14958.44. For the AMR service the cost is 46*$638.64=$29377.44 assuming 10 mile round trip which
is, again, conservative. So the NFR and AMR costs are conservatively, on the order of $45,000 per year.
Again, note the relative call volumes. 23 Temple generates about twice the number of calls as the next
worse location.
The combination of NFR/AMR and NPD then is on the order of $73,000 per year just for those service
calls.
Email from Alderwoman Brown:
Colleagues,
This past week I met with two of the three property owners and the office manager of the "Temple Street Hotel"
located at 23-25 Temple Street. Mr. Pleatsikas, Mr. Jeff Noury and the office manager known by the residents as
"Coach," gave me a tour of the facility. Mr. Pleatsikas called me earlier in the week to express concerns that two
Aldermen had made negative comments at a recent meeting and since I represent Ward 4 he asked for my
assistance. Today's Telegraph article "City's Temple Street Hotel remains under scrutiny" refers to those negative
comments and includes information about various violations that city officials found during an inspection this
summer.
Mr. Pleatsikas would like to extend an invitation to tour the building and can be reached at 603-493-1623 or via
email at TSR_LLC@yahoo.com. Knowing that unexpected life circumstances contribute to the poverty and
homelessness that exists in Nashua, weekly rent of $99 - $125 for a private room is a choice that some individuals
make and it may be the only other choice instead of homelessness. Instead of relying on rumor, I invite you to
meet the staff and see for yourself so that you can make a well informed opinion. Thank you.
Sincerely,
Pam
Alderwoman Pamela Brown
Nashua Ward 4
BrownP@NashuaNH.gov
603-930-6999
**************************************************************************
*
To laugh often and love much; to win the respect of intelligent persons and the affection of children; to earn the approbation of honest critics; to appreciate beauty; to
give of one's self; to leave the world a bit better, whether by a healthy child, a garden patch or a redeemed social condition; to have played and laughed with enthusiasm
and sung with exultation; to know even one life has breathed easier because you have lived--that is to have succeeded.
--Ralph Waldo Emerson
City of Nashua
Division of Public Health & Community Services
18 Mulberry Street - Nashua, NH 03060
Memorandum
To: Honorable Donnalee Lozeau, Mayor
Board of Aldermen Finance Committee
CC: John Griffin, Chief Financial Officer
Kerran Vigroux, Director of Public Health & Community Services
From: Robert Mack, Welfare Officer
Date: September 9, 2014
RE: Welfare Department housing and emergency shelter assistance
During the Finance Committee Meeting held on Wednesday, September 3, 2014, there were some questions
regarding the City of Nashua Welfare Department practices related to housing assistance.
The Welfare Department operates under RSA 165, which requires municipalities to provide General Assistance
relief to those who are poor and unable to sustain themselves. In Nashua, this is accomplished through
providing payment for basic needs such as housing, food and personal care items, utility assistance, prescription
assistance and burial / cremation assistance to those determined eligible under the City of Nashua General
Assistance Guidelines and Financial Standards.
Many applicants present to the City of Nashua Welfare Department with housing/shelter needs. Some present
to the Department already having housing but needing assistance with rental payments. Others are homeless
and have no housing/shelter. The Welfare Department staff does not place applicants in housing. Staff works
with applicants to explore available temporary and permanent housing resources such as emergency shelter
placement, temporary motel stays, subsidized and supportive housing programs, both permanent and
transitional, and general mainstream housing. Many of these types of resources and support services can be
found in the Greater Nashua Continuum of Care Toolkit, which is given to applicants for their reference.
Applicants are given a Rental Information Form to have completed by a landlord or motel staff. Once that form
is completed and returned to the Welfare Department by the applicant, along with any other required
documentation from the applicant, an eligibility determination is made and assistance is provided accordingly.
If applicants report issues with their current housing unit, Welfare staff refers applicants to the Environmental
Health and Code Enforcement Departments to address housing issues involving environmental hazards and code
violations in accordance with applicable housing laws and standards.
The Welfare Department is notified by the Code Enforcement Department of housing units with issued
violations in the City of Nashua and at risk of closure/condemnation in the near future. If a building or unit has
been found to be uninhabitable due to life/safety violations, the city will not pay for someone to live in the
building/unit until the necessary repairs are made. If there are other specific, documented issues with a rental
Page 1 of 2
unit not related to life safety, but which result in breaches of the land/tenant lease, the Welfare Department can
withhold rental payment on behalf of a tenant in accordance with RSA 540:13.
The Welfare Department works with local shelter providers to meet the needs of homeless individuals and
family households. When no emergency shelter is available, applicants are given a Rental Information Form
and instructed to locate room in a motel for temporary emergency motel placement until emergency shelter
accommodations become available. Applicants are informed of local motel establishments that will accept
Welfare Department vouchers. Once that Rental Information Form is completed by a motel and returned to the
Welfare Department by the applicant, along with any other required documentation, an eligibility determination
is made and assistance is provided accordingly.
I hope this information addresses the questions that came up during the Finance Committee Meeting.
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