Personnel/Administrative Affairs Committee

PERSONNEL/ADMINISTRATIVE AFFAIRS COMMITTEE NOVEMBER 10, 2011 A meeting of the Personnel/Administrative Affairs Committee was held on Thursday, November 10, 2011, at 7:03 p.m. in the Aldermanic Chamber. Chairman Ben Clemons presided. Members of the Committee present: Alderman Kathy Vitale, Vice Chairman Alderman Arthur T. Craffey, Jr. Alderman Paul M. Chasse, Jr. Members Not in Attendance: Also in Attendance: Alderman-at-Large Barbara Pressly Alderman-at-Large Mark S. Cookson (7:08 p.m.) PUBLIC COMMENT - None INTERVIEWS Business and Industrial Development Authority Heath Gaffney (New Appointment) Term to Expire: September 13, 2014 Mayor Lozeau Thank you Mr. Chairman. This evening I have three nominees as you can see on your agenda, and I am pleased to introduce you to Mr. Heath Gaffney. I met Mr. Gaffney after he wrote into the City website talking about his interest in serving the City in some capacity. As we always do, we say let’s take a look at what is out there and see what interests you most. He identified 2 or 3 different committees, took the time to go and see those committees in action, participated in a discussion with me about where he thinks he would offer the most, and we agreed that the Business and Industrial Development Authority is a place that he is interested in, he believes that he has something to offer that committee, he has, as I said, come to a meeting. We’ve talked about the plans of that committee going forward. I think he has done a little bit of homework, and I think that he would be a bit of a different voice on that committee than we have for some of our current members. I think that would really round out the committee. I am pleased to introduce him to you tonight for your consideration. Chairman Clemons Thank you. Mr. Gaffney do you have anything to say? Heath Gaffney I guess just that I’m looking forward to helping the City in ways that I can, and that is about it. Chairman Clemons Okay, great. I will open it up to questions from the committee. Alderman Vitale Was this the committee that you came forward to? With your background there are probably… Personnel – 11/10/11 Page 2 Heath Gaffney It does. It was the one that most interested me, absolutely. Alderman Vitale Very good. Alderman Pressly Thank you. I’m interested in the video surveillance. That is something the City does or is being done more and more for safety reasons. Is that related to what you do? Heath Gaffney It is very much so. I provide solutions. I own a small local company here in the City that we provide public safety solutions predominantly, what we call presence awareness solutions. It leverages different types of technologies for monitoring people or assets, and that can be anything from video surveillance to radio frequency identification technology. Alderman Pressly Do you have any experience in parking garages? Heath Gaffney We have done many installations of security solutions. Alderman Pressly Okay. What do you think of the EasyPass and the technology on the highways; is that related to what you do as far as… Heath Gaffney In essence, it is the same type of technologies that is leveraged. I am a fan of EasyPass; I wish more vehicles had them. It would certainly free up the highways a little bit from a traffic standpoint, but yes it is the same type of technologies that I offer. Alderman Pressly It is nice to have you aboard. Hope you will advise here and there as needed. Heath Gaffney As needed, absolutely, if I’m welcome to. Alderman Pressly Okay. Personnel – 11/10/11 Page 3 Chairman Clemons Is there anything further? I would only say thank you for coming forward. It is certainly great to see people step up to the plate and volunteer time to the City. Certainly appreciate it. I think you will be a good asset to the committee and I wish you the best. We will take up your appointment in a little bit. Thank you. Heath Gaffney Thank you. I hope to be. Alderman Pressly May I just explain to Mr. Gaffney I’m not making fun of what you do, I’m a fan of your type of business, and I would love to see the transponders used in the parking garages, and I understand this is being done in other parts of the world. I think it would really be a convenient thing to look forward to some time in the near future. Heath Gaffney Absolutely. Alderman Pressly That is why they are all sort of snickering. Heath Gaffney …audio inaudible…speaker away from microphone. Conservation Commission Mary Brundage (Reappointment) Term to Expire: December 31, 2014 Mayor Lozeau Thank you Mr. Chairman. As you can see on your agenda tonight, Mary is a reappointment to the board. Mary has been a very valuable member of the Conservation Commission. I think the board has done well from her council and from her participation. Short of the birth of her two children, she has had great attendance. As you can see she is a planner. You will find her to be very thoughtful, very professional, and she treats people with respect when they come to the committee. I think she has a lot to offer, and I’m very pleased that she was willing to serve again in this capacity. Thank you Mary. Chairman Clemons Ms. Brundage, do you have anything to say? Mary Brundage I want to say that I’ve learned a lot in the past three years serving on the Conservation Commission. One of the biggest things was knowing how much open space we actually did have in Nashua still left. I wasn’t really aware of that. I’m happy to serve on the Trail Subcommittee that recently formed in the past year for that. I would be honored to serve again if appointed for the next three years. Personnel – 11/10/11 Page 4 Chairman Clemons Great. Thank you. Are there any questions from the committee? Alderman Craffey Not necessarily a question, but just having served on the Conservation Commission I have been very impressed with Ms. Brundage’s knowledge and her input in the matters that come before the commission. Thank you for stepping up and re-serving. Alderman Pressly Thank you. Once again I’m coming after my favorite topics. Do you have any experience with rivers and the management of the vegetation along the rivers in your planning experience and your working on the Conservation Commission? Mary Brundage My Graduate Degree is in Natural Resource Management so I actually have a little bit of coursework background. In a professional capacity I have worked a little bit on watershed management planning not as specific to rivers and vegetation, but I do have some knowledge and background in that. Alderman Pressly That is great. Thank you. Nice of you to serve again. Mary Brundage Thank you. Chairman Clemons Again, I would only say thank you for coming forward again. You have served the commission well and you will do so in the future. Thank you. Mary Brundage Thank you. Chairman Clemons We will take up your appointment in a bit. Hunt Building Board of Trustees Richard LaRose (New Appointment) Term to Expire: December 31, 2014 Chairman Clemons Next we have the Hunt Building Board of Trustees and someone who really doesn’t need an introduction, but come on forward. Alderman LaRose thank you for joining us. Personnel – 11/10/11 Page 5 Richard LaRose Thank you. I’m glad to be here. Mayor Lozeau Thank you Mr. Chairman. I’m very pleased to bring before the committee for their consideration the appointment of Mr. Dick LaRose for the Hunt Board of Trustees. I will also be bringing him back, I will give you a little preview, he will be coming back to another meeting as I’m going to nominate him to be my appointment, my designee to the Planning Board coming up, and he has agreed to do that as well. I wasn’t certain that it had to be on the agenda tonight. That is why it didn’t get on there. It will come on for the next meeting… Chairman Clemons Great. Mayor Lozeau …but I just thought that I would mention that while he was here tonight. I think all of you know how much time over the years Mr. LaRose has given to the Hunt Building, how important it has been to him, his participation when he was ill to make sure that he had the opportunity to vote for funds to be spent on the Hunt Building was very very important to him, his institutional knowledge of that property and its history is very important. This is a time when I think for anybody that has dedicated as much time as he has to that building, this is the time where something is really happening and it is exciting, and it is not the same uphill battle that it has been for a long time for its care and upkeep. I think this is a wonderful time for him to be able to come back and serve in that capacity and see it take on its full glory that we are all expecting over the next couple of months. Your former colleague, I’m happy to present him. Richard LaRose Thank you. Thank you Mayor for thinking that I’m qualified to serve as a Trustee of the Hunt Building. I’ve been interested in the Hunt Building since the late ‘80s when the School Department left. For a while I was a Trustee. When Mayor Lozeau was running for Mayor just before she ran I told her that I was going to come in with some funding for the Hunt Building because my feeling was that we were nickel and diming it, a little here a little there, and we weren’t making any headway. She agreed with me. She also had some other ideas and so what the original bill that I had we incorporated with some of the bill that she had for the parking garage and the Court Street building and the City Hall and also the Public Health Department. Fortunately, talking to different Aldermen, we did get the funding and we have started with the Hunt Building. I think that one of the things that I want to do as a Trustee is to make sure that we continue maintaining that building and just not let it slide into decay. Maintenance is the key to all of our buildings, and I think the Mayor agrees with that and she has set up programs to do that. That is one of the reasons that I believe that I could help as a Trustee of the Hunt Building. Personnel – 11/10/11 Page 6 Chairman Clemons Okay great. Well I don’t think that there is anybody more qualified to be on that committee than you Alderman and I will certainly support your appointment. Alderman Chasse I won’t let him get away. Mr. LaRose I’m glad to see you. This was one of your primary projects, your pet peeve, whatever you want to call it. You have put a lot of dedication to the Hunt Building and I’m sure as a Trustee you will make a little profit over there so that it will not need anymore support from the City of Nashua. I’m sure that you will keep things up and running. I’m glad that you are taking an interest as a regular layman. Richard LaRose Thank you. That is the goal of the Mayor and myself and the Trustees is to get that building to be self- sufficient. Alderman Vitale I would agree that day will come around the corner and that will happen. If you ever want to take a drive with me down to Pennsylvania, I will take you to the Moravian Tile Works and show you how those tiles around the fireplace were made because they still make them the same way. Richard LaRose We don’t want that building to become in disarray. When you go up Main Street from the south to the north it is just a beautiful piece of architecture. You don’t want to lose those things. Chairman Clemons Agreed. Anything further? We will take up your appointment. Thank you for coming. Richard LaRose Thank you. COMMUNICATIONS - None APPLICATION TO LICENSE HAWKER'S, PEDDLER'S, ITINERANT VENDOR'S LICENSE - None Personnel – 11/10/11 Page 7 APPOINTMENTS BY THE MAYOR MOTION BY ALDERMAN CHASSE TO RECOMMEND THE CONFIRMATION OF THE FOLLOWING APPOINTMENTS BY THE MAYOR: TO THE BUSINESS AND INDUSTRIAL DEVELOPMENT AUTHORITY, HEATH GAFFNEY, 27 CATHEDRAL CIRCLE, FOR A TERM TO EXPIRE SEPTEMBER 13, 2014, TO THE CONSERVATION COMMISSION, MARY BRUNDAGE, 32 CATHEDRAL CIRCLE, FOR A TERM TO EXPIRE DECEMBER 31, 2014, TO THE HUNT BUILDING BOARD OF TRUSTEES RICHARD LAROSE, 18 DOGWOOD DRIVE, FOR A TERM TO EXPIRE DECEMBER 31, 2014 AND ROSALIE MCQUAID, 17 RESERVOIR STREET, FOR A TERM TO EXPIRE DECEMBER 31, 2016, AND TO THE MINE FALLS PARK ADVISORY COMMITTEE, MICHAEL DILLON, 15 VAGGE DRIVE, APT. B, FOR A TERM TO EXPIRE DECEMBER 31, 2014, JOSHUA SEGAL, 31 SCOTT AVENUE, FOR A TERM TO EXPIRE DECEMBER 31, 2014, MARK SOUCY, 16 SEVENTH STREET, FOR A TERM TO EXPIRE DECEMBER 31, 2014, AND PETER TESTA, 12 MAPLELEAF DRIVE, FOR A TERM TO EXPIRE DECEMBER 31, 2014 MOTION CARRIED Chairman Clemons Thank you all for coming. UNFINISHED BUSINESS – RESOLUTIONS R-11-111 Endorsers: Alderman-at-Large Mark S. Cookson Alderman-at-Large Barbara Pressly Alderman Arthur T. Craffey, Jr. REQUIRING BACKGROUND CHECKS FOR DIRECTORS AND INTERIM OFFICERS SELECTED TO MANAGE PENNICHUCK CORPORATION • Vetoed 10/4/11 • Reconsidered and Referred to Personnel – 10/11/11 MOTION BY ALDERMAN CRAFFEY TO RECOMMEND FINAL PASSAGE ON THE QUESTION Chairman Clemons Alderman Cookson did you want to speak to that? Alderman Cookson Thank you. This was referred back to committee from the full Board of Aldermen. It had received a veto from the Mayor, but fortunately we had the opportunity to bring it back. I think a lot of it had to do with the fact that we heard from a citizen that evening that brought some very important details that we thought we might be able to incorporate into this piece of legislation this evening including drug testing potentially, national database, criminal database, and so forth. I was hoping that the Mayor might rejoin us. She had indicated at the full Board of Aldermen meeting when it was referred back to committee that she would be participating in this evening’s conversation so hopefully she will make it back. Personnel – 11/10/11 Page 8 Chairman Clemons Okay. I think Alderman Chasse is going to find out for us. Did you have anything further? Alderman Cookson Not at this time. I will wait and let the conversation develop and then we will move forward. Chairman Clemons Did you forward the e-mail from Mr. Sullivan to anyone? Alderman Cookson I did not. Chairman Clemons I actually didn’t either, but I have a copy. Alderman Vitale I will say that the information that Mr. Sullivan was referring to that evening was considered. Although I don’t have a copy of it right at the moment, I know that the City went over each and everything that he suggested and what was incorporated into the information, and I think she is on her way to get it right now. Chairman Clemons I did bring the e-mail that he sent with some points in there. Alderman Craffey is going to make some copies and we will pass those out. Alderman Pressly I’m curious, when you say the City, who do you mean by the City? The building? Alderman Vitale The Human Resources Department came up and they… Alderman Pressly They gave an explanation of the… Alderman Vitale …matched up… Alderman Pressly …different ones? Okay. Personnel – 11/10/11 Page 9 Alderman Vitale …what the City does to what was on… Alderman Pressly Okay. Alderman Vitale …what Mr. Sullivan brought forward that evening, and for the most part the City does everything that is on the list. Alderman Pressly Okay. While we are waiting may I… Chairman Clemons Yes. Alderman Pressly My interest in this goes beyond just the Pennichuck. I think it is important that they have some special consideration, but I think that we need to take a look at how we interview and hire certain levels of city employees. It is no ill reflection on anyone that you want to do this because the best and finest of groups and cities and states, like look at the State of Pennsylvania today, things can happen that are just heartbreaking, and I think the more we can do…the things that come to my mind that you get into trouble is I think there is a fear, there is a fear of lawsuits. People are hesitant to let you know if someone is not appropriate to the job, they are afraid they are going to have a lawsuit, the fear of embarrassment, and I’m not sure how you get around that. I think you know I did sponsor legislation, and I’m not even sure where it is now, but the only group I know that has been able to penetrate that problem of being sued if you are honest has been the police department. I’m not sure that that is what we want, but at least they have found a way to be able to learn about candidates of a particular level, particularly those that work with children, to be able to really get a truthful analysis if they are appropriate for the job that you are seeking. I think it is fear of lawsuits and it is embarrassing. I think what is happening in Pennsylvania is a perfect example of how terrible things can happen just out of, I don’t know if you would call it carelessness or fear or whatever. But these things do happen to really fine institutions. I don’t think we can air too cautiously in certain circumstances. I’m not going to mention names, but we have had situations in the school department with some problems, we’ve had some problems with heads of departments here where we feel we have not gotten people that are appropriate for the job and they have a very short tenure. It happens everywhere and I think with the new technology that is out there today, the ability to learn things, to be able to get information…one of the problems of course is that if there has been litigation it is usually sealed. Let’s say you go on Google, which I have done, and find somebody in our school department that is in a lawsuit someplace else, well it is totally confidential so you have no way of penetrating that and find out what really happened. I think it is important for us to look at something. I’m not sure that this is it. I know Alderman Chasse you work in this area so you might have some good ideas as to how we can be extra cautious and ask the right questions and be able to vet people not only the Pennichuck board but our Superintendents, our various Personnel – 11/10/11 Page 10 department heads to make sure that we do get people that are truly qualified. That is my interest in this and it goes beyond the Pennichuck directors. Thank you. Chairman Clemons Mayor if you want to come forward, but I am going to let Alderman Chasse speak next. Alderman Chasse Yes I do have some human resource background. The one thing I have to say is when it comes to the police department and when it comes to the fire department and when it comes to the school board, whatever they do or how they hire their individuals, we have no policy over them. They are elected officials. They run their board or how they hire their people the way they want. We have no jurisdiction to tell the police department this is what you have to do to hire somebody. And if we go over here and we take this and we go through a full blown database of checking up on somebody over the whole country, you do it for one individual you set a precedent and you will have to do it for every individual that comes through the doors. Once you set a policy or once you do something, you go above and beyond of what is in place right now, you have got to do it for everybody from that day forward because if you don’t any somebody finds out about it…if they run a full blown background check on Alderman Clemons and he gets the job and they just run a mediocre one on me and he finds out about it, he’s got a lawsuit… Alderman Pressly That’s interesting. Alderman Chasse …He’s got a lawsuit all the way. And there are certain questions you can’t answer, and that is why when we talked about this that I think I had the opportunity to say you can’t ask that question. If you look at that list of people if there are any criminals on that list we are in deep trouble because it is a very unique kind of a list. There are some people that have made it big in the business world. There are lawyers on there. I will tell you from day one, and I’ve said it, I don’t feel comfortable with all of these 9 people coming in here and we are going to more or less, I’ going to call it rubber stamp, maybe it’s not the right thing to say, but we’re going to rubberstamp these 9 people to be the new board of directors for Pennichuck where there were probably 400 applicants. I believe right now that Alderman Vitale was in the process when they were interviewed. Am I correct with that? Alderman Vitale And Alderman Cookson on the first round. Alderman Chasse So we do have a couple of Aldermen that were involved, which makes me a little bit happier. When it comes time I guess they are going to have to put their input in because they have to make me happy. Like I say I think it was time consuming; 400 applicants, and I’m sure that we all have other jobs, well some of us have other jobs during the day and some of us are retired, but I would not want to have to go through 400 applications to find 9 people for a board of directors. Personnel – 11/10/11 Page 11 But we just have to be careful because if we take that step and we force this through we’re going to have to do it for everybody from here on in because you set a precedent. Thank you. Chairman Clemons Mayor did you have anything to say? Mayor Lozeau Yes. I would ask what the committee’s expectations are that you would like me to cover. Chairman Clemons I have a question and the question is very basically what has been done on the background checks, if anything, of the candidates that are coming forward and if they haven’t been done what do you intend to do? Alderman Cookson Can I add one aspect? Chairman Clemons Sure. Alderman Cookson Also included in that question I would be interested to know if the interim CEO of Pennichuck has also been through the same process because that is what this resolution indicates. Thank you. Chairman Clemons Okay. Mayor Lozeau All of the members including the interim CEO, which he is not the interim CEO yet because we don’t have the company, so he is our transaction executive as of today, have all signed their release forms, been fingerprinted, and all of the information and the checks are being done right now. I anticipate that to be done in the next week or so, to have that completed and the information back so that prior to them coming in for the committee’s consideration, we will know the information on their background checks. We don’t normally go the route, as Alderman Chasse was saying, we have to be very careful about what approach you are going to take with employees, you can’t treat some different than others unless you have already identified policies around the different types of employees that you are going to hire. For instance, we do a financial check on employees that are going to be handling money. That is policy here. Anybody that is handling it that is what happens. We do fingerprints on all of the people that are going to work in the school system so there are some things that we do. As Alderman Vitale can tell you, when the second round committee was meeting we went through, with the Human Resources Director, all of the different potential checks that we would do or not do. In essence, we cover them all with the exception of drug testing, which I do not recommend and would suggest we not do for Personnel – 11/10/11 Page 12 this kind of position. We do that kind of testing when necessary for people operating machinery and equipment and things like that, but I don’t think that is necessary for this group of individuals. Alderman Cookson Thank you. I just want to make a really basic distinction; these persons that we are considering are not employees of the City. They aren’t. They are going to potentially be members of a board of directors for a multi-million dollar company and we’re going to be having an interim CEO if the City is successful in getting ownership of the Pennichuck Corporation. These aren’t City employees, but we are treating them like city employees. Mayor Lozeau Well… Alderman Cookson That is what you just said. You have called them employees. The entire time that you have been speaking you have been addressing them as employees and I don’t believe that they are. As we have concerns about whether we’re establishing one policy and if we do it to this individual we’re going to have to do it to every individual, and if we put Alderman Clemons through a background check and we do a different one for Alderman Chasse that is going to raise…they aren’t employees, they are part of a board of directors to a corporation, which we might have ownership of before the end of the year A follow-up, I would be interested in knowing exactly what aspects of the background check were requested or required through our H.R. department, what information was checked, as you do a fingerprint check is that just done locally, was that done statewide, was that part of the national database? I would be interested in knowing to what level these background checks were done. That might reassure me. Mayor Lozeau Thank you Mr. Chairman. Alderman Cookson I don’t believe that I referred to them as employees. If I did it was not my intention. I don’t think anybody says it more often than I do that they are not employees. As I started, I pointed out that Mr. Patenaude was going to not be an employee of the City but he is currently an employee of the City. I was speaking based on what I was hearing from Alderman Pressly when I returned to the room and what Alderman Chasse was saying in general terms about background checks that we currently do through our H.R. Department. Alderman Cookson Okay. Mayor Lozeau These individuals have been treated differently and they have been treated differently because of actions that this group has taken including the acceptance of what I distributed to the group early on about what my expectations were going to be of the people that I was going to nominate for this board to consider. And in that I made a list of all of the things, not limited to, but these things would be included, and they are. A criminal background check both state and federal is being done, a check on their credit is being done, a check on their prior employment, their education, verifying the things they have told us are in fact correct. Those are some of the things that are happening right now. Personnel – 11/10/11 Page 13 When I bring them in, you will have a list of all of the items, don’t have it with me tonight, but of all of the items that have been checked, and people will be able to ask questions that are appropriate. Alderman Cookson Are you able to indicate which aspects of the background check, besides the drug test, weren’t selected to be part of this background check for the individuals? Is the drug test the only one? Mayor Lozeau I would not choose to check them on the sex offender registry, but they will be, that is an automatic as part of their criminal check so as a separate entity I believe it was Mr. Sullivan had it as a separate thing. It is not necessarily a separate thing. But other than that…I think one of the other items on Mr. Sullivan’s list if that is what people are referring to, was a county criminal search, and in New Hampshire that is not applicable. Other than that, I can’t think of any that weren’t done. Alderman Cookson What is the process with regard to what our H.R. Director is doing? They fill out a checklist and they distribute the request to our Nashua Police Department or does it go to our State Police? Mayor Lozeau Are you asking specifically as it relates to these candidates? Alderman Cookson Yes. Mayor Lozeau The H.R. Department does everything that I’ve talked about with the exception of the State and Federal criminal check. They normally do that, but in this instance I asked the police if they would do it for us because I thought the quickest way wasn’t the typical form but to do the fingerprint because they can do it much faster than we could. Alderman Cookson And you’re not making a distinction between federal and national in this instance? Mayor Lozeau No it’s the same. Alderman Cookson Just wanted to make sure. Mayor Lozeau I think there was something about other countries and that sort of thing. We’re not doing that… Personnel – 11/10/11 Page 14 Alderman Pressly Right, international. Mayor Lozeau We’re not doing that. Alderman Vitale And the Mayor did cover, I wasn’t sure if she would speak to the county part of it. That is what I wanted to bring up. Alderman Chasse I gather that there are no third party individuals that are doing the background checks; it is being done internally in the police department that is what you are saying? Mayor Lozeau That is what I’m saying, but I would argue that our people internally are processing it, but the people that are actually doing the check are a third party. Chairman Clemons Right. Mayor Lozeau It is the State Police; it is the group that does it for federal and that sort of thing. Alderman Chasse Right, but it is still not like A.B.C. Company. Mayor Lozeau No we didn’t hire somebody to go out and do what we are capable of doing. Alderman Chasse That was my question. This is what I’m looking at; we’re putting 9 people through a background check, which is okay because it is right here, yes I have it, and it says that if you want to be on the board of directors, selected candidates will be subject to background and credit checks. So they are doing that. That is fine. My question is now okay after they are done and Pennichuck is up and running and they need a replacement for somebody, there won’t be any background checks being done or if there are it is not us that will call for that shot, it will be the board of directors that will request that. It will be totally out of our hands… Chairman Clemons No. You could set a policy as the shareholder to require that they do that. You could. Personnel – 11/10/11 Page 15 Alderman Chasse You could, but I don’t think that is going to happen. Alderman Cookson I just wanted to follow up to that, this legislation is specific to this board of directors and this identified interim CEO, and what the board of directors does in the future with regard to replacements and whether they decide to do background checks, although we may do something with the articles of incorporation and establish policy for them, this legislation has nothing to do with the future, this is solely for this first board of directors. Chairman Clemons I understand that. Are you all set? Alderman Chasse I’m done. Alderman Pressly That is where my thinking was going too; this is just for one time. Although I am thinking beyond that. I think we should maybe have a policy that they do the same process once they are a corporate board and we are the one shareholder that they go through some process that we know about. Maybe not this, I see you frowning. I think it is important that we have some input on that so that was part of my question. I had another; on timing, did I understand the Mayor to say that the results of these tests are not in yet? Mayor Lozeau That is correct. Alderman Pressly Why not? Why have you selected people before you have the results? Mayor Lozeau Well because frequently we will do things contingent upon a successful check. I wanted to keep the process moving forward. If something comes up, I may withdraw a name… Alderman Pressly Is that normal for these things to take that long? Again, I’m thinking beyond these. I think this is a good discussion for us to have for lots of employee situations. If it takes that long is that normal for it to take…well tell me how long, a week, a month, two months? Personnel – 11/10/11 Page 16 Mayor Lozeau It would be pretty typical that it would be anywhere from 10-30 days depending on what checks you are doing. The majority of it is done, but we didn’t start this a long time ago. We just completed our selection recently. I wasn’t going to send people through to go through this process until I narrowed down the field. Alderman Pressly I think you answered my question then, this is not part of the application process this is part of the once you have been selected… Mayor Lozeau Exactly. Alderman Pressly …then we go back and … Mayor Lozeau You don’t want to make it part of the application process. With all due respect Alderman Pressly because it would be a very expensive thing and should we not choose to offer somebody a position we will have information that is unnecessary. Alderman Pressly However, think of the embarrassment after you select somebody and then find out a reason that you would rather not have them on the list. Mayor Lozeau There may be people that between now and the time they come before this committee might not be on this list, and it may have nothing to do with their criminal record check. It could be God forbid something happened to a member of their family… Alderman Pressly They choose to withdraw. Mayor Lozeau …I have a friend that just died tonight. A week ago I was talking to him about Pennichuck. There are lots of reasons why people could be withdrawn, but… Alderman Pressly I’m asking about the procedure so in other words… Personnel – 11/10/11 Page 17 Mayor Lozeau …but let me finish that thought because this is a little bit unusual… Alderman Pressly I realize that. Mayor Lozeau …okay so the reason that I made the decision to move forward with these 9 nominees as did the interview team is because we have an agreement that ends at a certain time, we want to be ready, we want to not hold things up as we move forward, so we’ve gone through a process which you can see in the information I passed out last night. First the vetting process then the interview process and the second round interview process then a final determination of narrowing down those that were recommended from the first team to go to the second team once we narrowed it down. Those letters had to go out telling them that they had been selected, the paperwork had to be brought in, and the fingerprints had to be done. We’ve just been following a process, and I considered this, why don’t I wait to not bring the names forward until everything is done and I’m positive that there are no issues, we don’t have the luxury of that right now, and I’m relatively confident that the professionals that we are offering would not be giving a fingerprint and signing a document if they had something that would give us a reason not to move them forward. Chairman Clemons And I would only comment too about embarrassment; first of all the embarrassment would be on the person. In other words if we found something in the background check that wasn’t kosher and we had to withdraw than nominee, the embarrassment wouldn’t be on the city the embarrassment would be on that person, and that is something that they would have to deal with themselves. I think you did this the right way. Alderman Pressly I’m not critical of how you have done it. This is the first time I’ve been able to be involved with any procedure on how you hire people of this level of employment and I just find it interesting that you have all of these background checks but they don’t have them in. If that is the way it is done in the hiring process that is good for me to know. I would prefer that you had all of that done before you invite them and go to a public hearing and all of that, but if that is the way, given the time constraints and all, that it has to be done, that is fine. Chairman Clemons We’re not going to hold a public hearing or we’re not going to have this committee until those are done. Mayor Lozeau Exactly. The interview from this committee will not take place until all of those are completed. Again, I’m just going to remind everybody I am the queen of the country known as no good deed goes unpunished. I did not want you to have your first look at them a week before the interview. I think the stakes are high here. I thought it would be courteous of me to get their names in for a first reading so I didn’t have to ask for suspension of rules and things like that to happen. They came in for the first reading, as part of that I gave you a document that has all of their resumes and their cover letters and the questions answered, lot of Personnel – 11/10/11 Page 18 information, so you have an opportunity to look at it. With the holidays coming and things like that, I wanted to be able to get it out there. When we have a better handle on what our results are, I’m working with the Chairman; we will select a date for that meeting for the candidates to come in. There are other things that I want to do before that as well that aren’t just related to that. Alderman Pressly I’m uncomfortable with this because I don’t look at this as the individuals who have been nominated. I’ve looked at them and I know some of them personally and they look like great choices. I’m looking at it just generically how one goes about doing this. I get the feeling, and please this is no reflection on the candidates at all, I just think it is important to understand how we go through hiring of this level and I do think in the future after we have this new board that we should go back and maybe come up with something, with the help of those of you who have experience in this field, something that we pass onto the new board of our expectations when they look for the replacements of themselves. That is where I’m coming from. Mayor Lozeau If I could Mr. Chairman, I just want us to make a distinction, similar to what Alderman Cookson made. This is the board of directors for Pennichuck, not employees, not hires. Okay… Alderman Pressly But we’re the shareholder. Mayor Lozeau …just let me…hang on, and I don’t have an objection to look at a policy… Alderman Pressly Yeah. Mayor Lozeau …on whether or not you want to do something going forward, but I see that as something separate than our hiring process internally for employees of different levels and what process we take; we’re getting their background checks, there is just a lot more to it and I don’t think you can compare what you are seeing right now to that same process. When I came in earlier you were speaking of things that you didn’t have access to or you didn’t see that you were concerned about and people’s tenure as employees and things like that. Right? You said short term tenure; information that we didn’t know that had been on resumes…did I mishear that? Alderman Pressly I didn’t use the word tenure. I’m not sure where that came from. I think the process of hiring applies across the board, not that you have the same system for each one, but since we’re discussing this I think it would be nice for us to also consider that there are other employees that might need some system and some policy. I’m looking for policy. Personnel – 11/10/11 Page 19 Chairman Clemons That may be a discussion for another time… Alderman Pressly Another time. Chairman Clemons …but right now we’re talking about the Pennichuck… Alderman Pressly Right, but I have not used the word tenure. I don’t know where that came from. Mayor Lozeau Mr. Chairman if I could, I don’t mean to put words in your mouth. I don’t like that either. All I was trying to say was I know that there are some concerns about employees that have been employed or were formerly employed by the City and I see that as separate and distinct… Alderman Pressly Right. Mayor Lozeau …conversation from this one. That is the only point I was trying to make. Chairman Clemons Okay. Alderman Pressly I agree. Alderman Chasse I want to give you a lesson in H.R. 101… Alderman Pressly Okay, good. Alderman Chasse I have a job for a financial analyst, every one of you sent me your resume, I look at the resumes and I say okay fine, I offer you the position for that particular job. Normally in two weeks you will be starting on a Monday. When you come in on that Monday you sign your paperwork, you also sign a release to do a Personnel – 11/10/11 Page 20 background check. It could be done somewhere during that two week span, but until you sign that release that company cannot do that background check. Now you start in the position, the background check is being done, in my company it is third party individuals that do it. They send us back the results. I get the results and notice that you have a drug problem; you can no longer work here. You are terminated immediately, immediately, no questions asked because when you signed your paperwork it was as an employee at will so at any time I can terminate you without having to declare any reason. But you will get the reason anyway because the background check failed. That is what happens. What we are doing here is perfectly normal. We are going in the right position, the right way. We don’t have a board of directors yet, not until we own the company. We’ve got 9 individuals who signed that release allowing us to do the background checks. If any one of those individuals did not sign that release, we wouldn’t be doing a background check on them. Now during the interim we could get that background check and the board of directors still hasn’t been established and we may replace two of them because they have drug problems. So you put two more on there and those two are put under scrutiny also. That is the way the cookie crumbles. Now after the board of directors is established and somebody retires or comes off, we can set policy, maybe we can, but that is something that is, like Alderman Clemons says, down the road. We’re not doing that here tonight… Alderman Pressly I understand that, but we’re having a discussion related to this type of thing. Alderman Chasse Right so… Alderman Pressly Whatever we do for these we might ask them to do for their replacements. Alderman Chasse …I’m confident with the background check that is being done. If the Nashua Police Department or the State Police are doing the background checks with fingerprints and everything you are going to get all of the dirt on those 9 people if they have any dirt. As for going for the world base and trying to find out if they did something in Europe or whatever, I think we are going a little bit overboard on this one. I think we ought to just move on with this. Thank you. Alderman Vitale I would like to mention again that the reason I referred this back to committee is because it was brought up the various different checks that were out there, just to have the opportunity to find out what checks we do as a matter of policy. We did not know at that time. That was brought up, it was compared to the list, and as it stands now this piece of legislation mentions having an independent contractor, which there was no need to have an independent contractor do it. The results wouldn’t be different or anything like that. I think that the goal of my sending it back to committee was met. I know the background checks that were being done they were thorough the City took care of all of the concerns that I heard from the citizens and different members of the committee. I’m very comfortable with the reason I sent it back to committee. Personnel – 11/10/11 Page 21 Alderman Cookson Thank you. Two points; one is that we are referring to, I have heard the number 9 and I know 9 refers to the number of members that are being considered for the board of directors. Again, I just want to mention that this also includes the potential interim CEO of the company so we actually have a number of 10 individuals that would be going through this background check. I’m satisfied with what the Mayor has shared with us. I would have liked to have seen the actual form to see all of the options that were available for a background check so that we could verify. Based on memory, we understand that the only thing that was not checked as far as a background check was the drug test and then there was the sex offender… Alderman Vitale It is done automatically. Alderman Cookson … which is done automatically. So those were the two based on memory, but I would still… Chairman Clemons The international. Alderman Vitale And the international. Alderman Cookson And the international. I would feel more comfortable seeing what that checklist was. I believe that Alderman Vitale saw it during the second round of the interview process. Alderman Vitale It is possible. I will see if that is something that can be brought forward, that you have a copy of what is this policy within the City. Again, that is from the City, but… Alderman Cookson I’m not interested in the policy of the City I’m interested in the options that are available for background checks… Alderman Vitale Compared to what? Alderman Cookson No. What are the background checks that are available to be checked off that we decide that this board of directors and interim CEO are going to be… Personnel – 11/10/11 Page 22 Alderman Vitale Okay, here is my question; are you talking about what was on Mr. Sullivan’s list that he e-mailed in? Then what list are you talking, compared to checks of what? Alderman Cookson I’m told that our H.R. Department, by the Mayor, has a checklist of items that they identify that a background check is done. That is the list that we have never seen that we don’t know what detail so again I refer to the three items that weren’t selected based on memory, but what is the list and are there other items. Alderman Vitale You have the e-mail from Mr. Sullivan? Alderman Cookson Correct. Alderman Vitale If you look at that list and you go over the three items so are the three that weren’t. Chairman Clemons Mayor glad you could rejoin us. Mayor Lozeau Thank you. Mr. Chairman I…. Chairman Clemons Could you shed some light on this? Mayor Lozeau …I could. There is not a checklist. Alderman Cookson Okay. Mayor Lozeau There is not a form. People sign a document releasing information to the City that can be had so to speak. It is a criminal background check. You can go on to the State Police website, it is available for anybody to download or print off, there are no checkboxes on it… Personnel – 11/10/11 Page 23 Alderman Cookson Okay. Mayor Lozeau …it is just you sign it and say yes, you can do my criminal background check and please send it to this address to this person, very simple. As far as the other items that we were talking about; education, credit check, all of that, it is a simple release that somebody signs and then our H.R. Department, again we are separating employees from Pennichuck, with Pennichuck we did many similar ones that we do with our employees; we have chosen, not on a checklist, but we have chosen to verify information provided by those candidates. In the instance that we are talking about, we’re verifying that they are or have been employed by the people they have said. We’re verifying that they do or do not have the education that they said, that they live where they say they live, those typical things that you want to make sure you verify. As I said, before they come in for an interview, you will receive something from us that tells you all of that information and what was checked… Alderman Cookson Thank you. Mayor Lozeau …not checked off, but checked as in a background check. Alderman Cookson Just one follow up if I might; Alderman Chasse in his description earlier between employing you and him, he made some reference to a thorough investigation versus a mediocre investigation and where does that distinction come in? Is that the party that conducts the investigation or… Alderman Chasse No. If I may… Chairman Clemons Alderman Chasse please. Alderman Chasse If I’m hiring a financial analyst, well a financial analyst will not drive an 18 wheeler, so I’m not too much concerned on his driving record versus his education, his background of what he has done in the accounting field. If I’m hiring an 18 wheeler truck driver, well if he’s got a drinking problem his alcohol level is .02 versus .08 for the rest of us so those are things. If I’m hiring an individual in a manufacturing area, again I would be looking for alcohol, drugs and things like that and put a priority on that versus his education because he is going to be a common laborer. If he is going to be operating chainsaws, heavy equipment… Personnel – 11/10/11 Page 24 Alderman Cookson Understood. Alderman Chasse …there are certain things. There are the standards ones; you are going to get the drug test anyway on everybody, financial analyst it doesn’t make a difference, but when it comes to the DWIs you pay more attention to like I say someone driving 18 wheelers and stuff like that. A credit check, okay so if he is going to be the CFO of my company, definitely he is going to have a credit check, but if you are out in manufacturing they are not going to run a credit check on that individual. They are not going to spend the extra money on… Alderman Cookson And there aren’t multiple levels of a credit check, there is a credit check? Alderman Chasse I’m not sure. Like I say a third party group does it. If there is embezzlement that will come out guarantee you, but if it is just somebody that had a personal business and it bellied up, the embezzlement you look at and the one where somebody tried a new business, maybe they had 2 or 3 businesses that bellied up, but at least they tried. Like I say it is still the company’s decision at the end if they want to hire that individual or not. You are just taking the credit check as a warning. Alderman Cookson Thank you. Chairman Clemons Alderman Chasse did you have anything further? Alderman Chasse No, I’m done. Alderman Pressly I would like to thank Alderman Chasse for that explanation. That makes much more sense to me than what I thought I was hearing. I thought at one time you mentioned consistency and the fear of lawsuits, but you are talking about it has to be the same category. Alderman Chasse Okay when you say consistency, if you are going to do… Alderman Pressly You said consistency. Personnel – 11/10/11 Page 25 Alderman Chasse …yes, I’m going to…consistency on the truck drivers, on the 18 wheelers, every drive of an 18 wheeler has got to be treated the same way, every manufacturing individual, all financial people have to be treated the same way. You do not run the same credit check for… Alderman Pressly There are categories that require certain things? Alderman Chasse There are categories, specific categories for… Alderman Pressly Further question; I would think that when you get into this process that there may be something that happens that makes you think, based on this information, we need to ask for one more… Alderman Chasse Oh absolutely. Alderman Pressly …does that ever happen? Alderman Chasse …sorry. Absolutely. Alderman Pressly Okay. Alderman Chasse A quick story, a kid had an assault and battery when he was 18 years old against his Wife. Now the guy is 35 years old. You are going to see that on a check and you say well the individual is married, has another family, is a good worked. He was a temporary worker and we wanted to bring him into the position permanently. He had that when he was 18, alright so now it is up to the company to decide if they want to hire him or not. But something that happened 18 years ago or something like that, are you going to deprive the guy of a job where he has been an outstanding citizen and you find out he is a basketball coach, he is this, and he is that. It is only a tool. That is all it is. A background check is nothing more than a tool for the company to make a decision. Alderman Pressly But there is some discretion. Personnel – 11/10/11 Page 26 Alderman Chasse There is. You have to use… Alderman Pressly There is discretion to make decisions. Alderman Chasse … sometimes common sense comes into play. Alderman Pressly Okay. Thank you. Chairman Clemons Is there anything… Alderman Cookson I just have one last question for the Mayor. Just wanted to verify or confirm that when the candidates do come forward there will be something that accompanies…what will accompany them besides what was delivered to us last night? Anything? Mayor Lozeau Yes. You will receive a letter from me or the Police Chief or the H.R. Director, we haven’t yet finalized who is going to do what, but you will receive information about whether or not they had, as we term it, a satisfactory background check. Alderman Cookson Thank you. Alderman Chasse Can I table this? Alderman Cookson Do what you want with it. Chairman Clemons The motion on the floor is to recommend final passage of R-11-111. Is there any further discussion on this? MOTION BY ALDERMAN CHASSE TO TABLE R-11-111 MOTION CARRIED Personnel – 11/10/11 Page 27 UNFINISHED BUSINESS – ORDINANCES – None NEW BUSINESS – None TABLED IN COMMITTEE O-11-75 Endorser: Alderman-at-Large Barbara Pressly RELATIVE TO THE USE OF ELECTRONIC DEVICES DURING MEETINGS • Amended & Tabled - 9/8/11 O-11-77 Endorser: Alderman-at-Large Barbara Pressly RELATIVE TO PUBLIC PARTICIPATION DURING COMMITTEE MEETINGS • Tabled 7/14/11 O-11-83 Endorsers: Alderman-at-Large Barbara Pressly Alderman Arthur T. Craffey REGARDING RELEASES FROM JOB CANDIDATES • Tabled 10/13/11 O-11-84 Endorser: Alderman-at-Large Barbara Pressly RELATIVE TO RECORDED AUDIO OF PUBLIC MEETINGS • Tabled 10/13/11 DISCUSSION Alderman Cookson I just wanted to thank everyone for a healthy discussion. I think we are looking out for the best interest of the City by looking at all of the details. We are going to put these 10 people in charge of running a utility and we want to make sure that we’ve got the best people out there. I wanted to make sure that we were covered, and I was hoping that this resolution, bringing it forward, it was a healthy discussion. Thank you very much for all of the information. I appreciate it. Alderman Pressly I would just like to say that I appreciate the discussion too, and I’m hoping that after we purchase the company that we at least consider what policies do we want to think about to ask them to implement. We don’t need to do that right away, but I think that is going to be part of our job. Everything that they do is going to be open to public scrutiny, they are going to follow the Right-to-Know Law, but I think it is very possible that we would expect them to follow some steps that are similar to what government does. We will have Alderman Chasse be in charge of that. Alderman Craffey Thank you. I do too want to chime in it was a very enlightening conversation tonight, very spirited. I want to say thank you to Alderman Chasse for leading us through H.R. 101… Personnel – 11/10/11 Page 28 Alderman Pressly Thank you. Alderman Craffey Thank you for sharing your knowledge. I do look forward to going forward with this company, with this legislation and of course legislation in the future. Thank you Alderman Chasse. Chairman Clemons Is there anything further? PUBLIC COMMENT - None REMARKS BY THE ALDERMEN - None ADJOURNMENT MOTION BY ALDERMAN CHASSE TO ADJOURN MOTION CARRIED The meeting was declared closed at 8:05 p.m. Alderman Arthur T. Craffey, Jr. Committee Clerk ~: Hackground screenmg IDtonnatJon that 1 cormmtte<l m sending to you. - Yahoo! Mall ~age 1 or 1. YAEOor. MAIL ClassiC' RE: Background Screening Information that I committed In sending to you. Thursday, October 13, 2011 9:16 PM From: -Robert Sullivan- To: aldermanbenclemons. Gents, In my haste to put this together there was an important word that I left out in the email just sent to you. Please see that word below denoted in red. Thanks, Bob Sullivan From: Robert Sullivan. Sent Thursday, OCtober 13, 20114:57 PM To: 'Mark Cookson' (cooksonm@nashuanh.gov); 'Benjamin Clemons' (clemonsB@nashuanh.gov) SUbject Background Screening Information that I committed In sending to you. Aldermen Cookson and Cemons, Based on the dialogue we had the other evening attached to this email for your review my basic recommendations for the type of background screening checks that you might want to consider and employ for the CEO and Board of Directors that will be appointed to the Pennichuck water works. I have attempted to put together descriptions of those services without the embellishment or sales ftuff. Included also Is a description of drug testing desaiption which the city I aldermen might also want to consider. Those that are denoted In red are screening services I components that you may want to skip. As mentioned previously, the Important things that should be considered are: 1. What type of screening services should be used for the job position in question (you may want to employ different background screening components for different job positions). 1111012011 Kb: Hackground Screenmg In1ormatlon that 1 comnutted m sendmg to YOu. - YshOO! M81l page J. ot J. 2. Is there a background screening policy and drug testing policy that denotes what Is acceptable and not acceptable results for hiring. Frankly this Is the challenge. If there is not one in existence then there should be. For all we know there may be these policies in place today at city hall. If they are then the question to ask yourself is are they adequate? If not I am sure that the HR person Is capable of putting one together after the policy Is put in place. It might be the responsibility of the Board of Aldermen to define that polley. If you need help then let me know. I did not Include 1-9/ E.yertfy services that essentially checks to ensure that the person in question has a vaIkI SSN and is a legal resident of the US. However, this Is not a difficult task lor the HR department to perform. Since I committed In sending "whoever'" my recommendations at the last BOA meeting- here they are. It is assumed that the Personnel Committee will take a look at this so for the reason of sending this email to Alderman Clemons. Please forward this along to anyone you want This background screening stuff Is not the easiest to understand. So if you do have questions then send me an email(s) and I will answer them in case you need a better understanding. The HR person at city hall could also answer your questions if In fact they are performing these checks. Frankly - it might behoove the aldermen and those on the Personnel committee to understand it and possibly improve what exists today based on the job functions hired at city government / hall. Regards, Robert Sullivan 11/1012011