Personnel/Administrative Affairs Committee

PERSONNEL/ADMINISTRATIVE AFFAIRS COMMITTEE FEBRUARY 25, 2013 A meeting of the Personnel/Administrative Affairs Committee was held on Monday, February 25, 2013, at 7:00 p.m. in the Aldermanic Chamber. Chairman Paul M. Chasse, Jr. presided. Members of the Committee present: Alderman Arthur T. Craffey, Jr., Vice Chair Alderman Diane Sheehan Members not in Attendance: Alderman Kathy Vitale Alderman June M. Caron Also in Attendance: Mayor Donnalee Lozeau Alderman-at-Large Brian S. McCarthy Alderman-at-Large Mark S. Cookson Alderman-at-Large Barbara Pressly Alderman Jim Donchess Alderman Mary Ann Melizzi-Golja PUBLIC COMMENT Lou Kominski, 13 Massachusetts Drive. I’m here tonight to speak about the Public Works meeting and I’ve made a few notes so I wouldn’t forget anything because I dragged this antique body out to express my views. I think the last afternoon or early evening is the best time for the meetings to start because that’s when more of the people can come and especially if you have a problem in your neighborhood, which I have had in the past, where I had to go to the Board and it’s just easier for people especially the workers and that’s the majority of the of the taxpayers and I view all the meetings at the Board level to be very loose and they are not really professionals and since the Mayor is not here today, she really dominates at least 75% of the meetings and there’s only one that really gives any input and that is Mrs. Pappas. The men really are very, very few words. I think that meeting only once a month and that’s one night a week, I don’t think that that’s a big thing to ask for the Board. After all, they ran for this job and we voted them in and we can also take them out. I get the mood of the meetings and I watch every one of them along with you people and I’ve had a few words with you. There are just not in a professional manner and I’d like to see that change. I know Mr. Cookson is there and he’s always a gentleman there but when they were complaining about the time, they are only there once a month so they had a big meeting and I thought it was really improper for the Mayor to say to Mr. Daly “we have a lot on our agenda today, make it short” and I thought that was very rude because when you are there and you’ve taken your time out of the day to come and address the Board, they should respect the taxpayer and I feel that the mood of the Board it seems like they are not really interested in us. There are interested in their own little ego and I’d like to change that and I think we would have to get a little more public participation. Katherine Poulin, 3 Nichol Lane. I’m also speaking on the same issue, the timing of not just the Board of Public Works but any public meeting. The timing of various Board meetings is an issue. The right to participate in the government is sacred in the United States. Times have to be conducive to allow this to occur. The average work day ends on or about 5:00 and having a meeting earlier than that does not allow for the participation from those citizens who do work. The obvious answer is to have the times after 5:30 to let people get there to participate. That the times haven’t changed since it has been brought to the attention of these Boards is a bit concerning. To bring this to a Charter Amendment is very serious and this document should not be changed just for a trivial matter, but the Charter acts as a Bill of Rights for the citizens of Nashua. It protects those rights just as Hamilton believed the Constitution of the United States protected the citizens of the United States’ rights. It’s the same rights on a local level and the right to participate needs to be protected and considered as inviolate. Personnel – 02/25/13 Page 2 Chairman Chasse Let the record show that Alderman McCarthy as joined us. Michael Chrissis, Allds Street. I’ve been a resident since 1986 and I have taken a particular interest in what’s been going on with the Board of Public Works and I’m going to quote the closing sentence from the Telegraph editorial on the 20th of February that says, “and it certainly shouldn’t require a silly change to the City Charter”. Wanting the meeting time changed from 2:00 is something that is more in conformance with other public meetings, is not a new issue. I don’t think it needs to be put on an agenda so that we have time to think about it. It’s been thought of over the years. It’s been almost as long as the Broad Street Parkway whatever the last change was in the meeting time. My response to the Telegraph was that, “sorry editorial team but it isn’t silly it is terrifically sad to have to resort to this to bring what it appears to be a (inaudible) ungovernable, public Board in the line with all other at large Boards. They control a lot part of Nashua’s annual spending and do not believe they are accountable to anyone. They schedule meetings for a time that excludes attendance to a large majority of the working public and I think this is intentional. They published abridged minutes so there’s no real telling that what you are reading is actually what happened. That doesn’t happen with the Board of Alderman but it happens with the Board of Public Works and they control an awful lot of money. The abnormal meeting time also makes it difficult for people to run for that office. If you’ve got to take time off of work for a 2:00 o’clock meeting once a month, a lot of people can’t do it so they just won’t run. So what it does is it creates a monopoly of membership on that Board for a number of people that have that time available to them and they continue to run. When someone tells me that in four consecutive terms, the 2:00 o’clock meeting has the highest response, my question is, where’s the fact? There are no facts to support that contention. The minutes do not show guest names, they do not show names of commentators and they take a fourteen minute conversation by a public participant in a meeting and summarize it in four lines in their minutes. That’s not right. If it were Board of Aldermen, it would be transcribed and I think it should be transcribed. Why do they want this meeting at 2:00 o’clock? Who knows? I’ve got my own ideas and I think a lot of people behind me do also. It is a matter of control. I think that the City Charter Amendment that specifies the time for all public meetings held by elected Boards would resolve the issue once and for all. This would eliminate all the arguing that’s going on and the knit picking about overtime that’s going to be caused by if we make it a 5:00 o’clock meeting. The overtime for a note taking clerk is miniscule compared to the $59,000 worth of overtime and was kissed off in paving one block of sidewalk in downtown Nashua and were promised from the Mayor that there’s going to be more overtime in the future. If that’s not thumbing a nose at the public, I’m sorry, I don’t know what else is. I think that this is a fool proof way, we’re not going to single out and say you’ve been a bad boy and we’re going to fix your wagon, everybody meets at the same time and I think that the wording should be changed to that. That way there is no debate that someone is being singled out. It makes everybody’s elected position available to the entire Nashua population. Dan Richardson, 70 Berkeley Street. I have to apologize, I’m not going to be able to ad lib tonight because, I had to work. Had to pay the taxes that other people aren’t paying. So what I did do ahead of time, is I prepared some statements and I’ll read those to you at this point. Concerning the letter to the editor that Commission Kevin Moriarty wrote in the Sunday Telegraph, I wanted to point out exactly what he stated there as an apology for the Mayor’s behavior at the Board of Public Works. It is the Mayor Donnalee Lozeau’s management style to have the Director of the Division of the Public Works as well as four Superintendents of the Departments within the Division attend each Board of Public Works meeting and this way questions can be quickly directed to the appropriate administrator and an answer arrived at without having to wait for the next Board meeting. This approach is efficient, smart and yielded time saving benefits. Now, what I have to do is I have to agree with him. I have to agree that the Mayor requires experts to be on hand during deliberations but what expertise does the Board of Alderman have on hand during its meetings. Typically, none. All you get is second hand reinterpretation of the Mayor’s memory but you also get the bonus of a political spin. Yes, you the Alderman as second class Board and conduct your business completely dishoned from first hand facts. Commissioner Moriarty continued to write, “research suggests that if one is to have a surgical procedure, it is better to have it in the earlier part of the day rather than later in the day due to possibility of error. There is Personnel – 02/25/13 Page 3 good reason for this strategy. The brain cognitively is more alert during earlier hours, perhaps better municipal decisions would be made if Boards met at earlier times, when they were cognitively more functional”. I found that very interesting. Well perhaps Commissioner Moriarty thinks that you, the Board of Alderman members lack cognitive capability due to your late night Board of Alderman meetings. Is he saying that you are producing brain dead decisions? Well I am not going to argue with the Commissioner. The February 7th Telegraph article states, “Lozeau argues thought that she cannot be more transparent than she already is”. Public Works projects are reviewed with Aldermen, their committees and at neighborhood meetings. “We are incredibly accessible”. I found that interesting too. The Mayor has made claims that the letter to the Board of Public Works is a resident’s adequate substitute to being physically present. I took that approach for the December 20, 2012 Board of Public Works meeting, writing a letter concerning the Mayor’s push to let the Chamber of Commerce Leadership Group pour more asphalt in Greeley Park for their private project. Then they can hang a brass plaque on it to themselves and pat themselves on the back for being so community minded. Now the fact is that the Mayor did paraphrase my letter aloud. That is the first half of the letter. She summarily dismissed the second half without reading it and without reason. I know what she did because I watched the tape. Does reading half of a citizen’s letter to a Commission sound like satisfactory public participation? But the story is even more twisted. When you read the formal Board of Public Works meeting minutes for that particular meeting you will find absolutely no hint of public participation via that letter. It was as if no letter even existed. Is that what the Mayor considers satisfactory public participation? It sounds to me like an official’s attempt to wash the official record of any public dissent. Robert Sullivan, 12 Stony Brook Road. I would like to thank Alderman Donchess for proposing an amendment to the City Charter relative to changing the meeting times of the Board of Public Works. I would also like to thank Alderman Deane, Craffey, Cookson, Pressly, Sheehan and Melizzi-Golja for endorsing this legislation that I believe is important. Approximately a year ago, I sent an e-mail to the Board of Public Works, I did not get a response indicating that they should change their meetings from 2:00 p.m. to 7:00 p.m. because it excluded citizens ability from attending and also came across that whether it’s intentional or unintentional, preventing people from running for the Board of Public Works. To me that last item is probably the most critical, regardless of whether it’s intentional or not, it does do that. It prohibits many people from running for the Board of Public Works if they have to meet 2:00 p.m., 3:30 p.m. or whatever. I’m told there was an article in the Telegraph today about this. I didn’t read it but I think you’ve heard my points on this issue. I think that the citizens could probably use an understanding of the steps associated with this process, I know that there was some confusion pertaining to the possibility of having a public hearing tonight. I think that it was a the Human Affairs Committee meeting tonight. I believe then it has to go to the Board of Aldermen where they determine whether or not this is necessary. Then I think it goes back to this Committee where a public hearing is chartered and then it goes back to the Board of Aldermen. I don’t know if I’m right but if someone could comment on the steps associated with how this will be processed, it would be appreciated. I also looked at the Board of Aldermen’s agenda for tomorrow evening. I did not see this particular issue being brought up to the Board of Aldermen, I think that the citizens would like to know if it will be pulled out of Committee tomorrow evening, because I think a lot of people would like to attend. I’d also like to thank Commissioner Pappas for her attempt to change the meeting times. I think it’s appreciated by the citizens of Nashua and if government, our publically elected officials and this is not the Board of Aldermen, because the Board of Aldermen cannot change the hours that the Board of Public Works meets, it can only put a question on the ballot to allow the citizens to make the determination of what time whether or not the Board of Public Works should meet no earlier than 6:00 p.m. as denoted in the legislation by Alderman Donchess. So if the Board of Public Works can’t do it on their own let the citizens of Nashua determine either yes or no. Nothing wrong with putting questions on the ballot, we should do more of that in this City. Barbara Nelson, 30 April Drive. My husband and I had occasion to go to the Board of Public Works in 2008 and again in 2010 on an issue of some concern to us. The only reason my husband was able to attend in 2008 was because he was due to retire in four months and he had two months of unused sick leave for which he would not be compensated so therefore, he didn’t care very much and was able to go. As we all know, the Board of Public Works consists of four Commissioners exclusive of the Mayor. Two of those Commissioners Personnel – 02/25/13 Page 4 have been on the Board for an extended length of time, at least a decade by my knowledge and probably longer. I feel that any Board that has members that are on that long, when the constitute half of the Commissioners involved, is a recipe for stagnation. I feel that basically the reason they have been there so long is because other people simply can’t do it for the same reasons that were expressed before me. I also feel that as far as the Aldermanic liaisons, we are curtailing ourselves there too. Granted, they can’t vote but they can certainly comment and when you have a Board of Aldermen, you obviously have people who bring various talents, skills and experience which hopefully can be matched to the liaison position they have. You are automatically limiting that when you make it during the day because Aldermen have to have a method of employment too. They have to earn a living. Either that or maybe they have childcare issues. A lot of people have daytime commitments and therefore that particular liaison, there’s a limitation on who can actually serve on these various Board and for those reasons, I support the passage of 13-95 and I hope you will consider that. Tracy Pappas, 12 Swart Terrace. am a Board of Public Works Commissioner. I thought long and hard of what I’m going to say and sometimes it’s really hard to follow how the meeting times have changed. First off, I want to apologize to the Chair of the Commission and to all the Commissioners that it’s come to this point. When I looked at how we deal with the Charter change I realized that one of the things that we say is “is it necessary”. When I ran, the Board of Public Works meetings were on Mondays and they were at 5:30 in the evening and as I said before, before I even entertained running for office, I got coverage, I needed about an hour of coverage until my husband got home from work. My youngest was seven months old. My neighbors helped me, said no problem, we’ll cover you. Then I got a call from the Chair of the Committee, “can we move it to 3:00 or 3:30” and I had to pick my kids up from school at 3:00 so I think we tried 3:30 and then moved it to 3:45. I’ve never been in government before and you don’t want to be unpleasant so I gave it my best go and thanks to neighbors, friends and family I was able to make it happen. A couple of bumps in the road, I had my kids left at school a couple of times and that was not a lot of fun. I realize that I don’t run a business, I was reminded of that and a lot of people don’t think of raising children as investing but I see that as an investment and that was rather difficult. This last election cycle, someone was elected and the day off was Thursday and I don’t have help on Thursday so I will take the heat to say that I can’t do Thursday, it’s going to have to work, why should this person have to close their business down. My business doesn’t close down so I was the one who said that I can’t make it work unless it’s 2:00 because then I could have a child at school until 5:30, the after school care. If you people ever watch the meetings, I don’t have an imaginary friend under the table. What happens is, I pick my daughter from kindergarten at 1:30 so I sometimes will pick her up a little bit earlier, I’ll be the first one in carpool and fortunately she’s real good and I bring her stuff to do and she sits under the table and again people probably think I have an imaginary person under there that I’m handing tissues to but had it been my boys, I don’t know if I would have had to resign from the Board, I don’t know what I would have done but I don’t think that folks should have to make that choice. People give you advice, don’t talk about this, don’t talk about that, well you know what, in the end I think that most people work during the day or have commitments during the day and I gave it one more shot. The reason I chose 5:30 is that that’s what I originally signed up for, number one and number two, that’s the earliest time that people who run at large have a meeting and that’s what the Board of Public Works used to have and that’s what the Fire Commission have. I don’t think the Fire Commission has a whole lot of public comment but they are always available for the people and I think that if you are appointed to a Committee and the Committee’s during the day, that’s very different than if you run at large and I’m very concerned that the people will not be well served and again, I’m sorry and I’m embarrassed quite honestly, I’m very embarrassed that this is necessary and that’s why at the last meeting I thought, we’ll try again because this should not have been a surprise, we’ve discussed this at nauseum and my sense from my fellow Commissioners the excuse was, well guess what, it’s in the Charter. The Chair can call the time, okay fine, so I think it’s going to take a Charter change and I think to ask people to come to run at large and come to a meeting that’s before 5:30 in the evening is unreasonable and if you look at the amount of money we spent at the last meeting, that is an awful lot of money and the Broad Street Parkway, my understanding is, you people have no concern over that now. Once that was approved, now you folks have no say over it. Now it’s all under our commission. That is an awful lot of money. I was reminded by the chair I was the only person on the committee that had never owned a business. As I said, I do not own a business Personnel – 02/25/13 Page 5 but I pay taxes and I know what services I receive. I couldn’t help but to notice how much money we spent on pretty things for downtown. This is the first year I have a child in public school system. My oldest is 14 and he’s a freshman at Nashua North. He doesn’t have a Spanish book. Of course he didn’t tell me. He’s probably doing a jig that he doesn’t have a Spanish book. But there is just enough for the classroom. They’re ten years old, there’s not enough available. I think it’s good to have individuals from throughout the city who have different perspectives because my view is why are we going to spend all this money on lights downtown when we don’t have enough 10-year old Spanish books for the high school? I think diversity is a wonderful thing, and I think having diversity on boards is a good thing. I think we allow more diversity if we have it later in the day. I thank you for your time. I apologize for having to bring this to you. I’m sorry. I tried it at our last meeting. Thank you. Lori Sutton, 12 Cannon Drive I’m here to speak in support of Alderman Donchess’ resolution 13-95. To keep this short, I’ll just say that I agree with all the points that have been stated before me. The Board of Public Works has control over too many taxpayers’ dollars for there not to be more access by the public via more convenient meeting time. Thank you. INTERVIEWS Chairman Chasse Before we start the interviews, I would like to take full responsibility on the way I handled the previously Personnel Administrative Affairs Committee Meeting. I watched the meeting again at home and I didn’t do a good job. To the Mayor, I apologize for that and I’m going to make sure that it doesn’t happen again. So I’m setting down some ground rules. Under this Committee, it is not our responsibility to find out how the Mayor or the President of the Board gets nominees for these committees. That is not what the function is of this Committee. The function of this Committee is to interview the individuals that come up in front of us and decide if they are a good fit to the Committee that they were looking for the nomination. So with that being said, we will keep it to the interviewing of the individual and not to the procedure. So Mayor would you bring your individuals up please. Conservation Commission Carol Gorelick (New Appointment) Term to Expire: December 31, 2015 Andrew Morin, Alternate (New Appointment) Term to Expire: December 31, 2016 Mine Falls Park Advisory Committee Pamela J. Anderson (New Appointment) Term to Expire: March 1, 2016 Mayor Lozeau I have just invited up the two members for the Conservation Commission. Mrs. Carol Gorelick and Attorney Andrew Morin. Thank you for your time and I appreciate your apology, it happens to all of us, best of times, best intentions, that’s just how things work sometimes. So this evening, I have, as I mentioned two members coming before you for the Conservation Commission. I’ll start with Mrs. Gorelick. Mrs. Gorelick is actually one of our local school teachers, had expressed an interest to me that she would love to find a way to volunteer. I don’t know how she finds time to do what she does now but she’s quite certain that she’s going to continue to have time to volunteer and was interested in how else she could help. I saw at an event and I pointed out to her four or five different committees that I thought might be a good fit and she reached back out telling me that Personnel – 02/25/13 Page 6 Conservation Commission would be a good fit. I think that you will see that on her resume quite a diverse bit of community service, of giving back, of knowing our City and I have found her to be somebody that is very thoughtful, I think she is very professional and I think that having her interested in the Conservation Committee can only be a good thing and I appreciate her willingness to serve the City in this manner. As far as Attorney Morin goes, he was recommended, he spoke with a former member of the Conservation Commission and talked about his interest in serving the City. The Morin family is a long time Nashua family that owns a business locally. As you tell from his resume, it’s eclectic. Somebody willing to volunteer, knows our City well, willing to give back and I think has the skills and ability to do what we are looking for. I’ll remind the Committee that one of the things that I frequently say to you when I come in is, I look for a few things from people. I look for somebody who can be professional and under that heading I would include how they treat each other on the Committee, how they treat the public when they come to the Committee, how they make decisions and the manner in which they present themselves. I look for people that can be objective, thoughtful, do their homework, know what has to be done, ask the right questions and I look for somebody that can put the time in, that will be able to attend the meetings, do the necessary work ahead of time in order to be able to come in and be an effective member of the Committee. I believe these two candidates before you for your consideration tonight are capable on all those accounts and then some and I’m happy to present them for your consideration. Chairman Chasse Mrs. Gorelick, would you like to comment? Carol Gorelick I’m just very honored to be able to serve the City and I look forward to it. Chairman Chasse Mr. Morin. Andrew Morin Good evening everyone. Thank you for your time, it’s the same as her, I just was looking for a way to get involved. Don’t know anything about the local government, so I figured that this was a way I could combine some of my interests and also some of my education and give back. Alderman Craffey What are your visions on, have you been to any of the Commission meetings at all, either one of you? Carol Gorelick No. Personnel – 02/25/13 Page 7 Andrew Morin I went last week. Alderman Craffey What did you think? Andrew Morin It’s a Commission meeting. Alderman Craffey There’s a lot of work. There’s a lot of legwork. I served as a liaison last term. There’s a lot of legwork involved. Andrew Morin That’s one of the good things about my situation, at least, is that the legal job market is horrible. I graduated in May 2011 so I’m starting my own office but this is one point in my life where I will have enough time in order to serve the Commission efficiently. Carol Gorelick I did meet with Committee members and we went over the commitment time and what was involved and the type of reading, research, looking into things and I am sure that I have the time to do this. Alderman Sheehan Attorney Morin, I see you worked for Albert Boss Marcotte for a while, did you do any work with land purchases or declaring and things like that? Andrew Morin I have not. I have done some title searches and wrote some deeds for my own office but I didn’t do any in his office. Alderman Sheehan I know he’s tough to get a job from. One of things that I’ve asked other land use boards is just their background, as it relates to how familiar they are with the subject matter and the answer is that we provide training but one of the things that I would like to see is some exposure to other training just so that there’s some different input, so I think your law background helps with that and having done land searches, I’m not sure with what his practice is if a lot of that has come to it but at least you have the availability to find the information so that makes me feel very, very comfortable and I’m also excited to see that hopefully some of the work on the Conservation Commission might make it back to a classroom with application and learning so I think that’s a good fit as well. Personnel – 02/25/13 Page 8 Alderman Pressly In looking over the Conservation Commission, I feel that there are so many potential new ideas that could be pursued. I was pleased that you mentioned that you studied what their purpose was so my question would be, would both of you be willing to look at new ideas, look at ways in the development of the waterways, to expand other ways to general revenue for the Conservation Commission, sort of some creative ways to manage the properties that you had, are you open to looking at new ideas and thinking them up yourself? Carol Gorelick I have a few new ideas myself. For land use, as far as, outdoor classroom usage, for wetlands, those types of things where citizens can have some broader passive use of the properties that we already have. Those are just a little bit of my idea for better usage of some of the lands that we already do have and looking into different ways that the land can be used for education. I don’t want to step on any Audubon toes, in that fashion. Andrew Morin The Conservation Commission statutes are very broad and when I went to the meeting I did feel as though it has been relegated to just a water, kind of getting through the water and what not. I don’t want to focus just on that, I would like to focus on, the Mayor let me know there was 900 acres that the City currently owns, the Conservation Committee, so I would be open to unique ideas and one of my passions is conservation. I’m trying to integrate science with also society, so I really think that I’ll be able to give a new vision and come up with my own unique ideas. Alderman Pressly Thank you, nice answers. Mayor Lozeau My next candidate is Pamela Anderson, she’s okay with being called Pam, I checked. Pam has been volunteering with the Mine Falls Advisory Committee for just over a year now. Going to their trail days, going to their meetings, being very active and had been encouraged to reach out to offer to serve as a more formal member of the group. It’s always interesting to me with the Mine Falls Advisory group, nine times out of ten, the people on that Committee come in for a full appointment because they’ve been a volunteer and they have been working with others and they’ve been encouraged because of their level of participation, to make that offer. As you can from Pam’s resume, she works on our Community at Gateways and again like Mrs. Gorelick, I’m not sure how she’s going to find the time but she’s managed to find it for over a year now. This is a good opportunity for me to mention one other item that relates to both of the groups of nominees tonight, which is as Attorney Morin mentioned earlier, I do talk to nominees of the committees particular these, about the ability for our citizens to have access to our parks along with our conservation land. So with 900 acres of conservation land in the city, I have asked the Conservation Committee about two years ago and I’m going to revisit them again, to really look at the conservation land and the ability to use it for passive recreation. I bring it up during this appointment because one of the concerns and one of the drivers for me is the use of Mine Falls Park and I’m concerned that it’s being overused because it’s really the only place that people think of as being accessible for that kind of recreation and I do think that we some other opportunities to look at. Trails and places for 5K runs, bird watching, jogging, walking, that sort of thing in other sections of the city that have that conservation land. Alderman Pressly asked about waterways, as you know, I’ve been talking to the Board about that before and there’s legislation pending in the Budget Committee to look at putting some funds towards that. I’m not sure that any of us have decided the best home for that work. It might be part of the Conservation Commission, it might be something else, I don’t really know but we certainly have to find a home Personnel – 02/25/13 Page 9 to take care of the issues that surround that. I think that this is a wonderful opportunity to have people talking about that and having people getting to know each other. One of the things that I would like to see is the Conservation Commission meet with the Mine Falls group and other groups in the city to talk about what are they doing and what are they seeing as needs, just as a way to bring fresh ideas to the table about what can we do and how to be good stewards. It concerns me when we own land or we buy it and then we block it off and say that’s conservation land. There’s certainly areas where you don’t want the public trampling around but there’s also opportunities for passive recreation in these other 900 acres that we should be considering. So I just thought that I would take an opportunity to mention that I’m very happy to bring somebody who’s enthusiastically been a volunteer for quite some time for the City before you for your consideration. Pamela Anderson It’s a wonderful opportunity to help preserve the historic landmark and help new people see what we have in our town. Alderman Craffey What type of new ideas can you bring to the Committee? Pamela Anderson Earlier, we were talking about bringing some children in so that they would understand what the gate house is and its reasons behind how it was built and why it was there and why the canal there. To refresh people to understand things. Somebody that might not even realize that Mine Falls is there, could come and check it out. Alderman Craffey The reason I ask is because that’s my Ward and I happen to agree with the Mayor and I agree that it is being overused. If you are on the Committee, how would you communicate with other Boards to help alleviate that problem? Pamela Anderson We could see what we understand and we could talk to other people to hear what their feelings are. There might be something that we don’t know that somebody else’s concerned about and if we work together we can figure things out better. Alderman Pressly I have attended a couple of their meetings and they are really interesting and they really do focus on the clean- up and the organization that is required and what they do just for the clean-up is not a simple thing. I know it’s very well organized and very well thought through so I hope you are strong armed. I also am pleased that it’s a wonderful resource and new ideas are always welcomed. Chairman Chasse Thank you for your willingness to serve. We’ll take up your appointment in a few minutes. Personnel – 02/25/13 Page 10 Mayor Lozeau If I could just take a moment off topic, I’ll be leaving as the nominees take their vote, but I just wanted to mention that I thought the Committee might want to know that R-13-95 and maybe Alderman Cookson may have brought it up, but I just wanted to make sure that at the last Board of Public Works meeting, we agreed that it would be on our agenda for the March meeting, so I just want to make sure that the Committee was aware of that. It might be a good opportunity for the Board of Public Works to take a look at it one more time to see if they would recommend a change. Chairman Chasse Before you run away, Mr. Gillespie? Are we tabling his? Mayor Lozeau No, he’s just a reappointment. So that’s why he’s not here this evening. I wasn’t aware that he had been asked to be present. Chairman Chasse So it must be a mistake, it says motion to table. Alderman Craffey He is on a land use board and he’s supposed to come for reappointment. He’s supposed to come before the Commission. The Conservation Commission is one of the Boards that all the reappointments are supposed to come before the Personnel/Administrative Affairs Committee. Chairman Chasse He has not visited us. Mayor Lozeau He has visited you. Alderman Craffey Even the reappointments, all the land use boards, reappointments are supposed to come before the Personnel/Administrative Committee. Chairman Chasse I think we interviewed him about a month ago. Mayor Lozeau I’m not sure how long ago it was that he came to that Commission but I’m sure he would have no problem coming in if you would prefer that to be the case. They serve until they are reappointed by you and/or replaced. So I don’t think that he would have a problem coming in. Chairman Chasse Personnel – 02/25/13 Page 11 All right, we’ll table it. You can set him up for the next meeting. COMMUNICATIONS From: Wanda Kennerson Re: Withdrawal of Nomination to Conservation Commission MOTION BY ALDERMAN CRAFFEY TO ACCEPT AND PLACE ON FILE ON THE QUESTION Alderman Cookson I didn’t have the agenda in front of me this evening. What was the subject of that correspondence? Chairman Chasse Ms. Kennerson decided not to take the nomination for the Conservation Commission, I believe. Alderman Craffey Yes. Alderman Cookson Thank you. MOTION CARRIED MOTION BY ALDERMAN CRAFFEY THAT THE RULES BE SO FAR SUSPENDED AS TO ALLOW FOR THE INTRODUCTION OF A COMMUNICATION RECEIVED AFTER THE AGENDA WAS PREPARED MOTION CARRIED From: E-Mail from George Farrington Re: R-13-95 MOTION BY ALDERMAN CRAFFEY TO ACCEPT AND PLACE ON FILE MOTION CARRIED APPLICATION TO LICENSE HAWKER'S, PEDDLER'S, ITINERANT VENDOR'S LICENSE - None APPOINTMENTS BY THE MAYOR MOTION BY ALDERMAN CRAFFEY TO RECOMMEND THE CONFIRMATION OF THE FOLLOWING APPOINTMENTS BY THE MAYOR: TO THE CABLE TELEVISION ADVISORY BOARD: ANDREW CERNOTA AND PAUL F. JOHNSON FOR TERMS TO EXPIRE JANUARY 1, 2016, TO THE CONSERVATION COMMISSION: CAROL GORELICK FOR A TERM TO EXPIRE: DECEMBER 31, 2015 AND ALTERNATE ANDREW MORIN FOR A TERM TO EXPIRE DECEMBER 31, 2016; TO THE MINE FALLS PARK ADVISORY COMMITTEE: PAMELA J. ANDERSON FOR A TERM TO EXPIRE MARCH 1, 2016; AND TO THE NASHUA ARTS COMMISSION, THE REAPPOINTMENT OF BONNIE K. GUERCIO, Personnel – 02/25/13 Page 12 CHARLES MATTHEWS AND FRANK TEAS FOR TERMS TO EXPIRE APRIL 1, 2016 MOTION CARRIED MOTION BY ALDERMAN CRAFFEY TO TABLE THE REAPPOINTMENT OF RICHARD GILLESPIE TO THE CONSERVATION COMMISSION MOTION CARRIED UNFINISHED BUSINESS – None NEW BUSINESS – RESOLUTIONS R-13-95 Endorsers: Alderman-at-Large Jim Donchess Alderman-at-Large David W. Deane Alderman Arthur T. Craffey, Jr. Alderman-at-Large Mark S. Cookson Alderman-at-Large Barbara Pressly Alderman Diane Sheehan Alderman Mary Ann Melizzi-Golja PROPOSING AN AMENDMENT TO THE CITY CHARTER RELATIVE TO MEETING TIMES OF THE BOARD OF PUBLIC WORKS MOTION BY ALDERMAN CRAFFEY THAT R-13-95 IS NECESSARY AND THAT A PUBLIC HEARING BE SCHEDULED ON THE QUESTION Alderman Sheehan I would like to amend this to include any elected board because I don’t think it’s right to single out one elected Board over another. That would be my intention. MOTION BY ALDERMAN SHEEHAN TO AMEND R-13-95 TO INCLUDE ALL ELECTED BOARDS ON THE QUESTION Alderman Donchess Having discussed this, broadening the concept of the resolution with various members of the Board, along the lines that Alderman Sheehan just mentioned, I had the legal department prepare an amendment so that the Committee could see it. I would suggest that all elected boards, those being the Board of Alderman, the Board of Public Works, the Board of Fire Commissioners and the Board of Education, shall meet no earlier than 5:30 p.m. in the evening if the meeting takes place Monday through Friday. So in essence it would require all elected Boards to meet after 5:30 p.m. unless there’s a weekend maybe, in which case working people could attend anyway. If the Chair would permit, I will hand this out to the Committee members and the other Board members that are here so you could take a look at it. AMENDED MOTION BY ALDERMAN SHEEHAN TO AMEND R-13-95 WITH THE AMENDED VERSION PROVIDED BY ALDERMAN DONCHESS THIS EVENING ON THE QUESTION Personnel – 02/25/13 Page 13 Alderman Sheehan Theirs is no analysis on the back, I would assume that the backside would be reflective of the changes to strike anything that says Board of Public Works to include either the language elected board or to list out Board of Alderman, Board of Public Works, Board of Fire Commissioners, Board of Education, would that be appropriate? MOTION BY ALDERMAN SHEEHAN TO AMEND THE ANALYSIS TO INCLUDE THE PROPOSED AMENDMENT PROVIDED IN ALDERMAN DONCHESS’ AMENDED LEGISLATION ON THE QUESTION Alderman McCarthy The four Boards are addressed in completely different sections of the Charter and it seems to me that the right thing to do is to amend those four sections with individual statements to this effect and not put it in one place which looks to be the Board of Alderman section. It’s not obvious without cross-referencing to that section that it applies to the Board of Public Works which is in Section 75 of the Charter. If we are going to proceed with this, I’ll address the issue in general, not in terms of the amendment but I’d actually like to Legal drop a better amendment that addresses the four different sections of the Charter where the Boards are established. Chairman Chasse You are saying that you would rather have them separate instead of a blanket? Alderman McCarthy Yes, it’s putting references to the Board of Education and the Board of Public Works and the Board of Fire Commissioners in sections of the Charter that do not apply to those Boards. Now the Charter has a section on the Board of Alderman and then it has a section on the Board of Education and then it has a section on the Board of Public Works and somewhere in there is a section on the Fire Commissioners and those go through how that Board is chosen, etc. etc. and it seems that if we are going to amend that, it should be amended in the right place for each of those Boards and not in one spot. Chairman Chasse So my question is, wouldn’t Legal have known that? Alderman Donchess I have another version which does what Alderman McCarthy suggests. I asked Legal to do it both ways so that the Committee could decide which was best. It lists four different sections of the Charter. I didn’t know which way the Committee would prefer to do it so I had both prepared and I have the other one as well. Alderman Sheehan This doesn’t require four questions on the ballot though? Personnel – 02/25/13 Page 14 Alderman Donchess No, they just did this for me today and they gave me two difference versions. So if the Chair again would indulge my giving this. Chairman Chasse I will let you know right now, I don’t like this. I don’t like it at the full Board, I don’t like it any other time when we get an amendment at the Committee meetings and we didn’t get a change to read it. Alderman Pressly May I say something while he’s passing this out? I had sent out a possible amendment to Alderman Donchess also that had to do with requesting that they keep verbatim minutes, so I guess my questions now is, how do we go about changing the Charter? I know it has to be voted on in November so I assume we have a timeframe that we have to work with. How much time do we have to work on this? If we’re going to have Charter questions it’s an opportunity to maybe look at a lot of things and there may be other ideas that come up. I assume if we go to a public hearing, we have to have all the ideas on the table. Chairman Chasse That’s what this is for. Alderman Pressly Right, but the one that I sent to him is not in there. Unfortunately, I don’t have a copy. It’s in my computer. Chairman Chasse Well you can always amend it at the full Board. Alderman Pressly I guess I’m wondering when do we have to have this done to get formally on the ballot. Does anybody have any idea? Chairman Chasse As soon as we accept this, then the next thing is we have to schedule a public hearing if we find it necessary. If we find it necessary in this Committee to have a public hearing, then we have a public hearing and then it comes up to the full Board, correct? Well it comes back to the Committee and we recommend final passage and then it goes to the full Board? Alderman McCarthy I think the answer to the question is sometime around July. Alderman Pressly Okay, so we have until July to consider the different proposals, take a look at them, clean them up in any way that we want and then as long as it is decided on July, it has time to get on the November ballot? Personnel – 02/25/13 Page 15 until July to consider the different proposals, take a look at them, clean them up in any way that we want and then as long as it is decided on July, it has time to get on the November ballot? Alderman McCarthy Yes, there’s a process and review by the Attorney General and the Secretary of State which takes a month or two and then we have to get it on to our ballot after that so that would have to happen in the late summer. There’s a danger of passing it too early which is, it has to be voted on within some timeframe after its past, so we can get ourselves in the position of creating another special election if we don’t hold off on it until such time as coincident with the November election. Alderman Pressly Do you think it would be wise to get all that determined before we take any action? Find out what the deadlines are, what the requirements are? I don’t know what they are, I do support this and there’re have been some other Charter changes, but I think it’s important to do it correctly because it’s not an everyday things that we do. Chairman Chasse All it’s going to do, is we are going to have a public hearing. If we go with a public hearing, it’s going to have to come back down to this Committee and then we can make some more changes, oh no we can’t. Alderman Pressly No you can’t, that’s why I’m bringing it up. Alderman McCarthy You would have to have another public hearing. Alderman Pressly So I think it would be advisable to take the time to figure out exactly what the rules are. All the items that we would like have the public take a look at and then move forward. I support this so I want these things to happen and be done right. Alderman McCarthy I do want to caution that the state law is quite clear that a Charter question can only address one thing. So whether verbatim minutes and meeting time constitutes two things or not is a matter of legal opinion and we would have to understand and if you put more than one or two things on, you get into the category where the State will determine that what you really needed to do was to put a question on to establish a Charter Commission to write a new Charter which can then be adopted or not. I don’t know where that threshold is, I would always caution us to be careful with Charter changes and to determine that they are really necessary before we undertake them. Personnel – 02/25/13 Page 16 Alderman Pressly I did ask Legal to draft it and they did combine it but I think this is new ground for them too. I think it would really be important that we do it correctly, make sure that we are following state law, meet the deadlines and if they need to be separated, have them separated. Alderman Melizzi-Golja I was also under the understanding that these had to be presented as separate things and I guess beyond that, I would not want voters to vote for something when they only agreed with half of it and have to make that decision so I would be very, very reluctant to combine things. I don’t think that’s fair to the voters to ask them to be making those choices. Alderman Craffey Couldn’t we pass the verbatim minutes by ordinance instead of having to put in on a Charter question? This question is to you Alderman McCarthy. Alderman McCarthy In general no. The elected Boards are free to govern themselves with their own rules and I don’t know that we can actually ordain anything that applies to anything other than ourselves. Alderman Cookson So in looking at version 2 of the proposed amendment to R-13-95, I think we see that section 4 relates to the Board of Alderman, section 58 relates to the Board of Public Works, section 73 relates to the Board of Fire Commissioners and then finally section 76 is that of the Board of Education. I’m not necessarily opposed to either one of these however, it ultimately comes out of the Committee. Hopefully, what will happen, as Mayor Lozeau was leaving she stated that, the Board of Public Works is taking this at their March meeting. It’s on their agenda and hopefully what we’ll find at that meeting is that there is more support of a time change and with that being said, and again to Alderman McCarthy’s point, it is difficult if you just have it at the elected body. The elected Boards and Commissions will or shall meet no sooner or no earlier than such and such a time, it only gets captured in one part of the Charter. Here’s where my concern is and somebody can speak up on this as well. This just specifies as its written right here, it only specifies in my opinion, the full Board. It doesn’t identify or include the sub-committees of those Boards and I don’t know if that is true or not but does it also relate to Infrastructure, Human Affairs, Personnel/Administrative Affairs or is it just the Board of Alderman as it’s currently written here in this document. I think that the only other Board that it would ultimately effect also would be that of the Board of Education and I know that they have got a policy committee, a budget committee and many other committees and I have typically seen those or at last some of those meetings beginning at 4:30 in the afternoon and I’m not sure of the reason why they begin at 4:30 in the afternoon, if its related to resources that they need or want included in those meetings as well, if they are calling on administrators or educators or whatever the case may be, I don’t know. High level question, does this also include the sub-committees of the Boards? Chairman Chasse Here’s my answer on it. I don’t like this at all. I don’t think that we should be putting anything on the Charter going on the ballot. There was nothing wrong with any of the other Boards, nobody has complained about them, they’ve all had their meetings, all the Board of Alderman meetings, the sub-committees, we are opening up a can of worms here. We’re creating waves. All it is, is just the Board of Public Works, that was the issue, nothing else. If something else came on down the road, you handle it when it comes in front of you but I don’t Personnel – 02/25/13 Page 17 see where we are putting in guidelines now for the Alderman, for anybody else, the other meetings. The Fire Commissioners, we know the Fire Commissioners meet at 5:30, there’s nothing wrong, it’s not broken, leave it alone, don’t fix it. Alderman McCarthy On the general issue, I guess I agree completely. I think that the Board of Public Works ought to meet at a time when people can get there and I don’t think there’s any dispute about that. I’m kind of reminded of a Bugs Bunny cartoon where Elmer Fudd has a fly in the house and by the end of the cartoon has blown the house apart with a shotgun trying to get rid of the fly. I don’t normally take to discharging shotguns in my ho use to get rid of flies, there are easier ways to deal with it and I then I bring that example up because the problem is that there is an easy way to deal with it. We could do this but there’s the law of unintended consequences and I think that Alderman Cookson just pointed to something I hadn’t even thought of until exactly that point. This does not apply to the Finance Committee because that is not a standing committee of the Board of Alderman nor any of the other Boards. It may or may not apply to the standing committees of the Board of Alderman and it may or may not therefore apply to any committee that his created as a creature of ordinance, so that we may in fact wind up by doing this, outlawing the Cable TV Advisory Board from meeting at 8:30 in the morning or outlawing the BIDA from meeting at a time when it is convenient to the members of that Board or any number of other things. I we find out that that’s the case, it’s really tough to fix it. We’re going to have another election before we can take care of that so I really like to understand these things and make sure they are necessary before we do them. It should not come to this, the Charter is the grant of power to the government from the people and that shouldn’t have to set the meeting times, it shouldn’t have to set the rules, it shouldn’t have to do any of those things. My basic opinion on the Board of Public Works issue is, it’s really between the voters and the members of the Board. We should tell them we’d like them to change their meetings, I think they should do that. I think that the remedy if they don’t do it is, if the public is really concerned about that, get a different Board of Public Works that will change when the meetings are. That’s what they would do with us if we started meeting in the middle of the day and nobody could come to our meetings. I don’t like using a bat to solve a problem that can be solved with a pen and I think that that’s where we’re at with this piece of legislation. Alderman Cookson Two points. The Board of Public Works will be meeting on the third Thursday of March and again, hopefully at that point in time, that Board, especially with the Mayor sitting here this evening, with that knowledge and information, maybe we will see a change which would result in this being null and void. I’m hoping that’s what happens. In additional to that as the liaison to the Board of Public Works I would be happy to deliver a message from the Board of Alderman, communicating to that Board our hope that their meeting times would be at a more convenient time for the public, just as Alderman McCarthy stated. I would be happy to do that on our behalf of the Board of Alderman. Chairman Chasse I suggest you take that up tomorrow night at the full Board. Alderman Cookson I would be happy to. Personnel – 02/25/13 Page 18 Alderman Sheehan This to me falls under a category that I call happened once. When I first came on the Board, there was something that was talked about all the time which was the change in the retirement package for the teachers and it kind of flew under the radar because it wasn’t a red lined cost item and that we try to do it but it doesn’t always come in on first reading with the red lined copy so it gets sent back and there’s some time lost and that was missed. So my easy answer was to codify it, that it has to be done and to me if this has come up once I think that it could eventually come up again and I think that everybody has had some very valid concerns and I completely agree and understand however, if it’s happened once and we haven’t addressed it, then to me that speaks to it could happen again and it’s very easy for it to just gradually creep back. My concerns with having it creep into other things are not, I think it can be very easily rectified by adding just a few key words like, this amendment would provide that elected body Boards such as the Alderman, Board of Public Works, etc. and their standing committees, sub-committees and Ad-Hoc and very specifically, so that we know that it’s not a group of the bidder whoever, downtown committee, there isn’t any creep and that we are very specific, that this is an elected Board and as Commissioner Pappas had mentioned, I too had young children when I first thought of running. At first they were too young and then it was very specific, what hours are they and that was a big consideration as to whether or not I could run and I think limiting our pool of talent of people who can run for any of these public offices is a miscarriage of our opportunity. It just limits us and when you limit your opportunity you’re not going to get the best result so I do think that this is a good idea, I think it sets down specifically that people who are in an elected office, know that it’s going to be during these times and these parameters. If I look around our horseshoe, I know that many of you would not be here if it was during the day and we all bring something different to the table, that I hear things I didn’t think of all the time from my colleagues. If we’re going to hold this up for Public Works and I understand and I hope that they do move it right away because the couple that Commissioner Pappas spoke about last time that were abutters that had tried to go to three meetings were my constituents and that was the concern because I was speaking with them and that’s where I gave the information on how to get in touch with the Board of Public Works, but I think that improving the open and transparency and making sure that anybody knows that they can run for these things and what time they are going to be, I think that’s a fundamental thing that is Charter related so I do think that having as many people to speak on something costs us less in the long run rather than having to redo something because somebody was not there to speak up. I was watching meetings, and I don’t want to pick on the Board of Public Works and if we tabled this until they got back to us, are we going to send it to the Board of Education, are we going to sent it to the Fire, that would be the fair thing to do as well. During the meetings, everybody was saying what a great job they did on the snow removal and it wasn’t our fault that it landed on a trash day or a school day that had late release and early release, it hit at 3:00 in the morning so when do you send the people in? We did as best as we could, given the circumstances but not one person was in the audience who said, really, because when I drove to Tyngsboro and the ground was black instead of white, they got the same storm. They have trash in Tyngsboro, they have schools in Tyngsboro. There needs to be some of that feedback, that I see as missing so I don’t want to see that just go away again because we forget fifteen years from now and we’re back in the same place. I think it has come up, I think it’s a reasonable thing to go to Charter and I think it needs a little bit more tweaking to include the words “elected bodies” and to include their committees, sub-committees and Ad-Hoc committees. Chairman Chasse Alderman Donchess, version 1 is still on the table right now. We did not eliminate version 1, you passed out version 2 but we never took the amendment. Would you be willing to table this and let the Board of Public Works see what they do. In the interim, Alderman Sheehan can mark it up and come back with it if we need to, with the new versions of what you’re looking at because it is kind of extensive and I think that maybe some work should be done. That is up to you. Personnel – 02/25/13 Page 19 Alderman McCarthy I just want to make one more comment about the law of unintended consequences. Regardless of how it applies to those Boards, if you read the language here that says, can’t meet before 6:00 or whatever it is, 5:30, except in an emergency, a lot of things happen that aren’t necessarily completely within our control. If for example, a member of our congressional delegation says, I’d love to meet with the Board of Alderman at 3:00 in the afternoon and present you with a check for $500,000 to do X, that’s not going to be an emergency. What do we do, send them a letter that says sorry, don’t want your money, can’t take it at 3:00 in the afternoon? Reason has to prevail for government to work right in general so I understand Alderman Sheehan’s point about we might fall off the wagon on this. There’s a lot of other things that we could get unreasonable about that are not in the Charter. There’s plenty of stuff in our rules, Charter doesn’t allow for public comment periods for example. We could eliminate those if we wanted to. Is it a good idea or a bad idea? I don’t know, it’s an idea that the Board should take up in context over time. It’s not something I feel comfortable nailing down at the Charter level and then finding out what that really means in the long term. I would first like to see the interference from the audience with the meeting stopped and secondly, I would like to see what the Board of Public Works does about the issue first and I really want to warn us against taking shotguns to flies. This is a big thing to do, I don’t think it’s necessary. I think that the problem can be solved. Chairman Chasse Alderman Donchess, I hope you don’t accept that piece of paper. Please don’t accept that piece of paper. We’ll have the Telegraph come down on top of us. Alderman Donchess All right, let me give it back. Can I give it back after I answer your question? You asked me would I mind postponing it. I think the simple answer is, as long as it could get to the ballot and I think the answer to that if we do postpone, I think the answer to that question is yes. Also the Chair had said that you didn’t appreciate the fact that I brought these things in so late and I get that point. I wanted to get back to that, I was away for a couple of days, this came in by e-mail today. I printed it at 6:40 and I brought it in. I think the point is well taken, that if possible, I should have circulated it but I didn’t have it until twenty minutes before the meeting. Back to the main question and I would ask a follow-up to Alderman McCarthy, it seems to me that there is enough time to wait and see what happens at the Board of Public Works and to think about the various points that have been raised. Alderman Sheehan has mentioned that maybe it should be in the Charter and maybe it should apply to all Boards, Alderman McCarthy has raised the issue of unintended consequences, maybe we should think about both of those points over time rather than over five minutes. As long as Alderman McCarthy thinks there would be time to wait for a month or so, or a few weeks, whatever it comes to and handle it in time to put it on the ballot, if the Board of Public Works does not change its meeting that would be fine. May I ask him if he thinks there would be time? Alderman McCarthy I think there’s plenty of time. We need to make a decision on it somewhere in July or August timeframe so if we brought it back to the Board, even at the beginning of June, we could schedule a public hearing so I think there’s a few months to look at what happens. Alderman Donchess Then, Mr. Chair, I certainly can live with the delay. I would like to add that I think it is important for the Board of Public Works to meet at a time when people can go and participate on that Board like to other Boards. The idea that we would meet in the afternoon, obviously we would never do that, for the same reason that the Board of Public Works should meet in the evening. So I think that it’s important but maybe the Board of Public Personnel – 02/25/13 Page 20 Works will change its attitude or maybe we’ll bring it back in a version that everyone agrees on. In any event, given the circumstances, I don’t have a problem delaying this. Chairman Chasse Would you like to put it in the form of a Motion? Alderman Donchess Sure. I’ve got everybody else raising their hands which says they want to make the motion. Alderman Cookson Would it be possible to make a request of our City Clerk to identify deadlines associated with having this appear on the ballot? There are other issues with the Attorney General’s office, can we at least get a rough draft of deadlines that we need to meet in order to make this happen should it come to that? Alderman Donchess When do you want it postponed to, the next meeting or when do you meet again? Chairman Chasse I’m looking to table it. If it comes back and the Board of Public Works does not change their hours, it will be on the next agenda. MOTION BY ALDERMAN DONCHESS TO TABLE R-13-95 MOTION CARRIED NEW BUSINESS – ORDINANCES – None DISCUSSION Alderman Pressly I just have a question related to the action that the Committee just took. I had sent counsel work on further amendments so if there are some other ideas that people would like bring forth to this Committee, do you want them all sent to the Committee ahead of time? What’s your pleasure on that? Chairman Chasse I think that if you had some other stuff that you would like to see put into the amendment, seeing that Alderman Sheehan has just put the whole thing together, then maybe she might be able to incorporate it into the next one so that if we have to bring it back to the table at the next meeting, everything is in there. Instead of piece- mealing it again. Alderman Pressly However, it is a different idea. Alderman Melizzi-Golja mentioned that if you expand it and include too many things. I would like to comment on your opening statements regarding the last meeting and something really interesting for me has taken place and you all might regret being so good with the computer because I’ve been taking classes now. I’m able to do more research than I’ve ever done and it’s been really been interesting for Personnel – 02/25/13 Page 21 me to go into our public records regarding the different committees and the different things that take place at City Hall and it’s really been sort of interesting because as I’ve gone through, I brought it up before, I have uncovered just with the people I know, numerous, numerous inaccuracies in these Committees and I don’t think it’s anyone’s fault. I think it’s a matter that the only people that really know the composition of these Committees, who’s coming, who’s gone, is somebody who is there and unless there is some way to make a change into the website that makes these more accurate, it’s really confusing for anyone. This gets me back to there’s a place that you can maybe volunteer for a Committee or for anything but I’ve asked a couple of people that know nothing about this to look it over and get their reaction. The reaction has been that it’s very confusing. Are there vacancies, are there not vacancies, is this person there. So I think we do have an issue there that needs to be looked at. I don’t have a solution in mind, I’ll give you my favorite example and that’s that I saw where a person that I know moved to Florida five years ago is listed as the contact person. If somebody’s interested in the Committee or that job, they are supposed to call that person and they have been in Florida for five years and I know that that’s a little bit extreme but that’s an example of the inaccuracies and it’s not the Clerk’s fault, it’s not the Mayor’s fault, it just is. Is it worthwhile to get this changed and I think that there might be a solution but it comes from within the Committee and I’ll give you the example of CTAB because I serve on that and I spoke with our Chairman and I said, what do you make of this and we have brought up at every meeting that our roll call is inaccurate and we brought it up time after time and somehow it does not get changed and he doesn’t know whose job it is to get it changed. He said maybe it’s IT’s job and certainly they don’t think it’s their job so I bring this up because it has come up many times about people volunteering so I have no idea whose volunteering, or if it’s working or not. I think we do have a problem and I don’t mean to be critical of this Committee, of the Clerk of the Mayor, but I would suggest that everybody who’s a liaison or has any interest or connection with any of those Committees, go on line, take a look at them and see if it make sense to you. I know that I randomly looked on some and I knew people hadn’t attended or been part of that meeting, they were current members and hadn’t attended a meeting for over a year, that they had resigned two years before, so maybe this isn’t important to you but this is the Personnel Committee and it’s what you all deal with or maybe you’d rather have someone else do it. Chairman Chasse Personnel/Administrative Affairs Committee does not own the website. The website belongs to the administration of the Mayor. It’s not my duty to go in there and say there are some irregularities that’s not my jurisdiction. Fixing things on the website is not my jurisdiction. It’s not even the Board of Alderman’s responsibility. That belongs to the Mayor and that belongs to the IT department which falls under her. If the website is wrong, it’s their duty to fix it, not ours. Not ours to go in there and say fix this or fix that. When we make appointments, it’s up to the Mayor and the IT department to put them in there, if they don’t, it’s not my responsibility to make sure they are there. It does not fall under the Personnel/Administrative Affairs Committee. Sorry. Alderman Melizzi-Golja For the two Committee’s that I serve on as a liaison, when there have been concerns about who is listed and whether new members are listed and whether or not there’s an accurate count, my practice has been to work with whoever it is in City Hall that is the liaison with the Committee and ask them to check it out and see what’s going on and to make sure things are appropriate. To Alderman Chasse’s point, to work with whoever it is in City Hall. So for ethnic awareness, it’s the City Clerk for the Hunt Building it’s Mrs. Mortellaro. Those are the two people that I would work with when those situations came up or I had concerns. Personnel – 02/25/13 Page 22 Alderman Pressly Then I just would like to make another comment. Very often when the Mayor brings in her candidates and most of them are absolutely terrific, if not all of them, she often times will acknowledge how she encountered them. So she, on occasion, comes in and references how she knows this person or how she’s never met this person before and that they stepped up and volunteered. I think that it is appropriate for some of us who would like to know, well how did this person come into this because she often times mentions it. Does it do any harm to find out, Madame Mayor, how did you encounter this person. She very often says that anyways. I know at the beginning of this meeting you ruled that you wouldn’t allow that and I’m going to ask that you Chairman Chasse Be careful with your words. I did not say I would not allow that, I said it’s at her pleasure and also as the President of the Board, they bring the people in. I don’t have a say on how we pick them, they can do it verbally or by paperwork, they can do it by going on line. I don’t know. It’s not my jurisdiction to find out how, my jurisdiction is to bring them in here, interview them, see if they are a good fit to the Committee. It’s either a yeah or nay and that’s my duties. That’s the duties of this Committee when it comes to appointments by the Mayor or appointment by the President, that is the procedure. Cut and dry. Alderman Pressly Is that in law or is that just your interpretation as the Chair? Is that the way the law is written? Chairman Chasse That’s what I was told when I took over as Committee Chairman. It’s not for me to break the process, whatever process they have, I don’t get involved in their process. Are you all set? Alderman Pressly I guess, you’re the Chair. Alderman Donchess I’m not agreeing or disagreeing with anything that either you or Alderman Pressly have said, except for one thing. In terms of actually who controls the website, I would say that that is property of the City, a website is intellectual property of the City and therefore, if the Board of Alderman cared to exercise jurisdiction over it and control it, we could. Just like a building, just like a vehicle, it’s property of the City which under Charter, Ordinance and State Law, the Board of Alderman has jurisdiction over. That doesn’t have anything to do with the Personnel Committee or anything like that, I’m just saying as kind of a general proposition, that’s the way I believe jurisdiction would lye if the Board of Alderman, as a whole, ever chose to exercise it. PUBLIC COMMENT REMARKS BY THE ALDERMEN POSSIBLE NON-PUBLIC SESSION Personnel – 02/25/13 Page 23 ADJOURNMENT MOTION BY ALDERMAN CRAFFEY TO ADJOURN MOTION CARRIED The meeting was declared closed at 8:38 p.m. Alderman Arthur T. Craffey, Jr. Committee Clerk, pro tem On Feb 24,2013 7:44 PM, "George Farrington" <gfarrington66@Yahoo.com> wrote: To the BOA 1 have been reading about the controversy concerning the meeting time for the Board of Public Works and thought, for what it's worth, I'd share a few thoughts with you on the matter. The issues here are the kinds of things that should be able to be resolved by reasonable adults. At the same time, we do live in a system where majority rules so an individual, or small group of individuals, can't expect to dictate terms. I think the proposed resolution (R-13-095) sets a dangerous precedent. What will you say the next time an individual, or some small group, wants you to get involved in the business of some other Board or Commission? What happens if a citizen wants to attend the meetings but they work in Boston and can't get home for a 6:00 p.m. meeting? Will you amend again? Where does it stop? Just because someone says something isn't "transparent" or "open" doesn't make it so. BPW agendas are posted, as are written meeting minutes, audio recordings of meetings and the meetings run on the local access television station. All of the individual members have phone numbers and email addresses available on the City web site. And of course there is always the general public comments part of your agenda. In addition to all of that, the Telegraph welcomes letters to the editor and guest commentary columns. It seems pretty open and transparent to me. Beyond that is a seat at the table and a vote, and there is a process in place for that also. With all of these opportunities, to stay informed and communicate with the BPW, available to the citizens of Nashua 1 don't believe it is "necessary" to amend the charter. Further, why tie the hands of a future Mayor who may, for some unforeseen reason, want to conduct the Board of Public Works meetings in an entirely different That brings me to my final point. It has been about two years since some of our fellow citizens, who thought they would like to be Mayor, took a look at the prospects of winning and chose not to run; or did they? A blind person paying only minimal attention can see the political aspect to this activity. Taking a rather small issue, helping it grow with a little hyperbole, and then taking credit for saving us all from a terrible situation through some legislative action is the kind of politics we see all of the time in Washington. Of course, if you can make an opponent look bad in the process, so much the better. This practice isn't pretty or productive nor does it serve the citizens well in Washington or in Nashua. The world isn't coming to an end. Putting this item on the ballot and asking the citizens of Nashua to take a position on something that doesn't affect the vast majority of them, and that they don't care about, is not a responsible, disciplined way to conduct the business of the Nashua. George Farrington  (VERSION 1) PROPOSED AMENDMENT TO R-13-095 RESOLUTION PROPOSING AN AMENDMENT TO THE CITY CHARTER RELATIVE TO MEETING TIMES OF THE BOARD OF ALDERMEN, BOARD OF PUBLIC WORKS, BOARD OF FIRE COMMISSIONERS, AND BOARD OF EDUCATION CITY OF NASHUA In the Year Two Thousand and Thirteen RESOLVED by the Board of Aldermen of the City of Nashua that pursuant to RS A 49- B:5, the following amendment to the Nashua City Charter is deemed necessary and shall be submitted to the voters by placing it on the ballot at the next regular city election in the manner required by NH RSA 49-B with the following summary: Shall the municipality approve the charter amendment summarized below? This amendment would provide that the Board of Aldermen, Board of Public Works, Board of Fire Commissioners, and Board of Education meet no earlier than 5:30 pm in the evening if the meeting takes place Monday through Friday unless emergency circumstances related to the city's business require a meeting at an earlier time. Amend the City Charter by adding the new underlined language as follows: 58-a. Meeting times of the Board of Aldermen, Board of Public Works, Board of Fire Commissioners, and Board of Education The board of aldermen, board of public works, board of fire commissioners, and board of education shall meet no earlier than 5:30 p.m. in the evening if the meeting takes place Monday through Friday unless emergency circumstances related to the city's business require a meeting at an earlier time." This amendment shall be effective upon passage by the voters.  (VERSION 1) PROPOSED AMENDMENT TO R-13-095 RESOLUTION PROPOSING AN AMENDMENT TO THE CITY CHARTER RELATIVE TO MEETING TIMES OF THE BOARD OF ALDERMEN, BOARD OF PUBLIC WORKS, BOARD OF FIRE COMMISSIONERS, AND BOARD OF EDUCATION CITY OF NASHUA In the Year Two Thousand and Thirteen RESOLVED by the Board of Aldermen of the City of Nashua that pursuant to RS A 49- B:5, the following amendment to the Nashua City Charter is deemed necessary and shall be submitted to the voters by placing it on the ballot at the next regular city election in the manner required by NH RSA 49-B with the following summary: Shall the municipality approve the charter amendment summarized below? This amendment would provide that the Board of Aldermen, Board of Public Works, Board of Fire Commissioners, and Board of Education meet no earlier than 5:30 pm in the evening if the meeting takes place Monday through Friday unless emergency circumstances related to the city's business require a meeting at an earlier time. Amend the City Charter by adding the new underlined language as follows: 4-a. Meeting times The board of aldermen shall meet no earlier than 5:30 p.m. in the evening if the meeting takes place Monday through Friday unless emergency circumstances related to the city's business require a meeting at an earlier time. S58-b. Meeting times The board of public works shall meet no earlier than 5:30 p.m. in the evening if the meeting takes place Monday through Friday unless emergency circumstances related to the city's business require a meeting at an earlier time.  (VERSION 1) PROPOSED AMENDMENT TO R-13-095 8 73-a. Meeting times The board of fire commissioners shall meet no earlier than 5:30 p.m. in the evening if the meeting takes place Monday through Friday unless emergency circumstances related to the city's business require a meeting at an earlier time. §76-a. Meeting times The board of education shall meet no earlier than 5:30 p.m. in the evening if the meeting takes place Monday through Friday unless emergency circumstances related to the city's business require a meeting at an earlier time." This amendment shall be effective upon passage by the voters.