City Council
Regular MeetingAndover, MN · September 28, 2021
Minutes
ANDOVER CITY COUNCIL WORKSHOP MEETING – SEPTEMBER 28, 2021
MINUTES
The Workshop Meeting of the Andover City Council was called to order by Mayor Sheri
Bukkila, September 28, 2021 at 6:00 p.m., at the Andover City Hall, 1685 Crosstown Blvd NW,
Andover, Minnesota.
Councilmembers present: Valerie Holthus, Jamie Barthel, Ted Butler, and Randy
Nelson
Councilmember absent: None
Also present: City Administrator, Jim Dickinson
Public Works Director/City Engineer, David Berkowitz
Fire Chief, Dennis Jones
Fire Captain, Jeff Cielocha
Others
CONTINUE DISCUSSION ON 2022 STREET RECONSTRUCTION/ASSESSMENT
METHOD PROJECT/22-2
The City Council is requested to continue the discussion on the method of assessment for the
proposed 2022 Street Reconstruction Project. Mr. Berkowitz explained the City’s standard
assessment method does not provide the most equitable distribution of costs due to the variation
in size of the lots. He reviewed previous discussions and proposed methods.
Mr. Berkowitz provided five options for the Council to review. Mr. Berkowitz displayed maps
and tables illustrating the options and assessment costs.
Option 1: everyone pays the same amount. $7,000 per unit
Option 2: dividing the project into 2 sections and have each section pay a flat fee: $5,100
or $8,100
Option 3: dividing the project into 3 sections and have each section pay a flat fee: $5,100,
$7,100, and $11,200
Option 4: hybrid method using 2.5 acres as the separation point. Take the cost of road in
front footage, and divide by the number of units. The assessment would be $5,600 for lots
under 2.5 acres and $10,400 for lots above 2.5 acres.
Option 5: hybrid method similar to Option 4 but using 3.5 acres as the separation point.
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Minutes – September 28, 2021
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The larger lots are separated from the smaller lots. The assessment would be $6,600 for
lots under 3.5 acres and $9,900 for lots above 3.5 acres.
The Council discussed the options and asked for clarification. The Council discussed previous
methods of establishing assessments and the challenges this project brings.
Mayor Bukkila stated she is leaning towards Option 4. Councilmember Barthel agreed because
the smaller lots get a lower price.
Councilmember Butler stated he leans towards Option 5 because there are similar lots that will
be split at 2.5 acres and paying very different amounts. He stated Option 5 provides a clearer
division.
Councilmember Holthus suggested overlaying the distance the resident has to travel on the road
to get to their home and applying the assessment.
Councilmember Barthel suggested three categories for lot sizes: 1 acre, 1-3.5 acres, and 3.5 and
higher.
Councilmember Nelson stated he likes Option 4.
Mayor Bukkila stated the Council has never assessed based on lot size in the rural zone before.
She stated if three categories were selected, the City would not be consistent and may be setting
a new precedence.
Mayor Bukkila polled the Council and four members favored Option 4.
Jason Sichler, 4936 171st Avenue NW, came forward and stated he has polled his neighbors and
they feel everyone should pay the same amount.
Councilmember Barthel would like the Council to address rural roads and spend time on how
much is assessed. He stated rural roads are subsidized by the urban area. He would like to
discuss the topic at a future workshop.
Mr. Sichler, came forward, and asked what the additional cost would be for a concrete curb. Mr.
Berkowitz stated it will be approximately an additional $800-$1,000 per lot, and three times that
for the City funded portion.
FIRE DEPARTMENT UPDATE
Chief Jones presented the current staffing structure of the Fire Department related to duty crew
and paid-on-call coverage. He explained the requirements of current firefighters and the benefits
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Minutes – September 28, 2021
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they receive. Chief Jones presented the risks of the current structure including unfilled shifts,
reliance on all-call response, increased response time, and differing levels of responsibilities for
the same benefits given. Chief Jones explained this problem is not unique to Andover and occurs
across the country with on-call firefighter departments. Chief Jones displayed the costs for the
current Fire Department staffing structure.
Chief Jones presented a duty crew proposal increasing duty crew time from 12 hours to 18 hours
per day. Captain Cielocha explained the call volume, proposed duty crew schedule, and staffing
numbers. Chief Jones noted the proposed requirements for firefighters including 10 hours per
month of duty crew, shift time, training, and station maintenance. Chief Jones stated the benefits
of the proposed model are an 18-hour per day uniformed response, quicker response time,
consistent cost for the City, better trained members, and equal responsibility for all members.
Chief Jones noted there is an additional amount of time the Fire Department is asking of the
firefighters per month.
Councilmember Holthus asked what would make a firefighter not like the proposal. Chief Jones
said it is a change and change is difficult. He stated the City is asking more of firefighters. Mr.
Dickinson noted the City began a duty crew because there were times during the day when there
weren’t any firefighters available to respond. In addition, there are times when call volumes are
high and when there are more firefighters that respond than necessary.
Councilmember Butler asked about the response time to the northwest part of the City if the duty
crew were housed out of Station 1. Chief Jones explained the duty crew would respond from
Station 1 and firefighters for Station 2 would also be called to respond. Mayor Bukkila noted the
Sheriff’s Department would also be dispatched, creating layers of response.
Councilmember Butler asked how many current duty crews are not filled. Captain Cielocha
stated all shifts were filled when he first started, however, through retirements and attrition, there
are several shifts now left unfilled. He stated the weekends are going unfilled and the Fire
Department has to put out an all-call which results in more firefighters than needed responding to
calls.
The City Council discussed the benefits and challenges of the proposal. They stated the cost will
increase, but the City will provide better service to the residents.
Mayor Bukkila asked what the daytime duty crew will be doing in between calls. Chief Jones
stated they will be conducting fire prevention, presentations, maintenance of equipment &
station, training, cleaning, inspecting, reviewing plans, fire ordinance compliance, CO2 and fire
detector installation in homes, and tours and demonstrations. Mayor Bukkila noted that a lot of
those responsibilities have been going on. Chief Jones stated a lot of those responsibilities have
been overlooked recently because full-time staff are responding to calls and not able to do the
work. Chief Jones stated they had to cancel the open house in part due to lack of staffing. Chief
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Jones explained the morning duty crew sets the stage for the day. He stated the evening hour
shift can be doing inspections and preplanning and having a presence at the high school or at
high school activities.
Councilmember Barthel asked how maintenance and equipment will be maintained at the other
stations if the duty crew is housed out of Station 1. Chief Jones stated the duty crew will rotate
around stations to conduct those responsibilities. Captain Cielocha stated firefighters will be
cross trained among the stations and have responsibilities at each.
Mayor Bukkila asked if the City had a road map to implementing the proposal. Mr. Dickinson
stated the City is structuring the model and will plan implementation in January of 2022. The
plan is still being developed.
Mayor Bukkila stated Mr. Dickinson was tasked to meet with fire officers about the proposal and
asked him the outcome. Mr. Dickinson stated they discussed the budget, call responses, and duty
crew. He indicated they did not get into the details of the proposal and would like the full
support of the Council before expanding the duty crew. Mayor Bukkila asked if they could bring
the proposal to the firefighters and ask for feedback. Chief Jones stated he has been transparent
and inclusive. He explained the problem has been going on for a long time and he has asked for
input. He stated the response he has been given by some firefighters has been resistance. Chief
Jones indicated the firefighters with 9 years or less of service tend to be in favor of change.
Mayor Bukkila stated the buy-in of the firefighters is essential.
Mr. Dickinson noted the proposal makes two primary changes: going to an 18-hour duty crew
from a 12 hour and putting a mandatory requirement to commit to duty crew. He noted response
times led to this proposal. Mr. Dickinson explained the alternative is worsening response times,
more all-calls, more risk, and potentially hiring more full-time department staff with higher
expenses. Mr. Dickinson outlined the investment they make in each firefighter with the cost of
training, hourly rate, and the fire aid to pension. He asked if it is reasonable for the City to have
expectations of the firefighters the City has invested in.
Mayor Bukkila asked what happens if the City moves to this model without involving the
firefighters and half of them quit. She asked how to avoid that situation. Chief Jones said they
will approach the membership with the proposal and ask them how they see this working. He
stated it is not set in stone, and is based on math. Mr. Dickinson explained staff are seeking buy-
in from the Council to go the next level to reach the desired level of staffing. He stated the
proposal may need to be stepped in, but at some point, the City needs to reach the goal.
Councilmember Holthus asked how many firefighters would quit. Chief Jones estimated a
handful of firefighters would leave. He explained the Fire Department is somewhat divided by
years of service. Captain Cielocha stated those who aren’t responding currently are the ones who
aren’t going to be in favor of the increase in requirements. He feels that the firefighters who are
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on board will fill in the hours. Mr. Dickinson state the department will continue to recruit. Mr.
Dickinson stated being sensitive to COVID the response requirements were pulled back during
the last year and a half and the requirements weren’t enforced. He explained benefits were still
provided to the firefighters during this time.
Councilmember Butler asked if it would be difficult for the day duty crew to meet the call back
requirements. Chief Jones stated it is hard for them now to meet the requirements.
Councilmember Butler asked if duty crew responds to a call, does it count toward their
requirements. Chief Jones stated currently it does not count. Captain Cielocha stated the
firefighters tell them their night or daytime availability and are scheduled accordingly.
Councilmember Butler stated he is in support of the plan but is concerned about the firefighters’
point of view. He would like to know what benefit and flexibility they will get. He
recommended looking at the requirements and adjusting them where appropriate.
Chief Jones stated firefighters are also given 21 days of vacation. Captain Ceilocha stated
firefighters are given forgiveness of the requirements if exposed to COVID as well. Captain
Ceilocha stated they need people to respond to calls.
Mayor Bukkila explained the proposal is a big organizational change without considering what
the firefighters are looking for. She asked how the City gets their buy-in.
Mr. Dickinson explained it will be a working implementation. Chief Jones stated if the plan gets
support from the Council he will go to the membership. He noted if the Council gets calls from
firefighters, the Council can provide support for the plan. Chief Jones stated the idea has been
brought up multiple times before and the membership is split primarily based on years of service.
Councilmember Barthel indicated he supports the plan but would like to get feedback from the
firefighters. He pointed out that there are more daytime duty crew hours than overnight hours.
He suggested allowing people to work more duty crew hours and have a reduction in the call
back requirement. Chief Jones stated he is not opposed to that idea.
Mr. Dickinson stated everyone agrees the City needs a better service model. He noted the
implementation will have to be carefully thought through and they will get feedback from the
membership. Mr. Dickison said the priority here is achieving reasonable response times.
Mayor Bukkila asked each Councilmember their opinion.
Councilmember Holthus said she likes the model but said it needs to be flexible. She wants them
to get feedback from the firefighters and be willing to modify the plan.
Councilmember Nelson stated retention begins the moment you recruit someone. He said it is a
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good idea to sell the plan to the firefighters and gain their feedback. He asked if other cities use
this model. Chief Jones stated they looked at similar sized departments, population, and call
volume, and found they have duty crew and some have up to a 50% call back requirement. Chief
Jones gave the example of the Lake Johanna Fire Department who uses a similar method.
Councilmember Butler supports the new model and getting feedback from the firefighters. He
recommends going to the firehouse and not presenting it as a plan that is already decided upon,
but as an option for a solution. Mayor Bukkila suggested giving a historical explanation to the
firefighters as well.
Mayor Bukkila said she is not set on a January 1 start date. Mr. Dickinson indicated they can be
flexible on the implementation date, but the goal is to hit a basic level of service.
Mayor Bukkila asked to have an update by the November workshop. Mr. Dickinson stated he
will provide updates to the Council as needed and they will continue to work on the plan,
implementation process, and to gather feedback. Mr. Dickinson noted they will be flexible,
however, if this model does not work, they will need to look at another option to solve the
response time problem.
Mayor Bukkila recessed the meeting at 8:04 p.m. The Council reconvened at 8:10 p.m.
DISCUSS DRAFT 2022-2026 CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT PLAN (CIP)
The City Council is requested to review the 2022-2026 CIP and provide direction to staff. Mr.
Dickinson stated the draft is similar to last month’s presentation. Mr. Dickinson presented the
CIP by City Department and asked the Council to ask questions or comment as they went along.
Mr. Dickinson addressed items the Council discussed at the previous meeting. Mr. Berkowitz
stated the maintenance costs for the shared dog park with Anoka County and the City of Coon
Rapids will increase about $500 per year if the trail is constructed. He explained the long-term
cost will include replacement in around 20 to 30 years. Currently, the City allocates $3,000 in
maintenance costs for the dog park.
Mr. Dickinson addressed the proposed safety netting at Sunshine and Andover Station North
Parks. He said the cost of the netting is $240,000 and the maintenance commitment is putting
them up and taking them down each year. He indicated the lifespan of the netting is 15 to 20
years. The Council discussed the value and cost of the netting. The Council reached consensus
to take it out of the CIP.
Mr. Dickinson addressed the street reconstruction budget and funding it through bonding. The
City Council reached consensus to start the process to consider issuing bonds for street
reconstruction.
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Minutes – September 28, 2021
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Mr. Berkowitz explained the water tower will be painted and the Council will need to select a
color and logo. The Council reached consensus to keep the color the same and make the logo
bigger.
The City Council reached consensus to remove the railroad underpass from the CIP.
2022 SPECIAL REVENUE, DEBT SERVICE, CAPITAL PROJECTS, ENTERPRISE &
INTERNAL SERVICE FUNDS BUDGET DISTRIBUTION & DISCUSSION
The City Council reviewed the Special Revenue, Debt Service, Capital Projects, Enterprise, and
Internal Service Funds and provided direction to staff. Mr. Dickinson provided highlights of the
funds and asked the Council to ask questions or comments as needed. The Council did not
request any changes. The EDA budget will go before the EDA for approval.
2022 BUDGET DEVELOPMENT DISCUSSION/UPDATE
The City Council is requested to discuss the 2022 proposed budget and provide direction to staff.
Mr. Dickinson reviewed the 2022 Budget Development guidelines and highlighted changes since
the Council’s last discussion. He explained employee health care cost is still to be determined.
He will bring the Public Works Union Contract to a closed session at the next Council meeting.
Mr. Dickinson stated the taxable market value is $3.8 billion and the tax rate is 36%, which is
less than the tax rate in 2017. He noted the largest budget increase outside of street construction
is the Fire Department at $226,000.
Mr. Dickinson noted the outstanding items are the Fire Department structure, employee health
insurance, the Public Works Union contract, and further potential levy reductions.
AUGUST 2021 COMMUNITY CENTER UPDATE
The City Council is requested to receive a presentation on the Community Center for August of
2021 and provide questions or comments. Mr. Dickinson provided an update on facility usage.
He indicated that Subway is not renewing their lease and staff are searching for a replacement.
He noted they will be looking for a vendor and providing simple items for sale by existing staff
in the meantime. They are also exploring an option for booster clubs to fill the hours.
Mr. Dickinson provided the Council with an update on senior programming, after school
programs, and programs for teens. Councilmember Holthus asked if the Community Center has
been affected by vandalism from youth. Mr. Dickinson stated they have had significant damage
from youth and the YMCA has had to increase their staffing to provide additional supervision for
the middle schoolers.
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Mr. Dickinson provided a financial update stating revenue overall is on target. He stated ice
rental revenue will be higher because of summer programs. He indicated they are looking when
the best time is to have turf in the sports complex.
Mayor Bukkila asked why there was a significate increase staffing. Mr. Dickinson stated
additional staffing were needed to operate the building expansion.
Mr. Dickinson provided a summary for September 2021 facility usage, noting a hockey
tournament that will bring a number of out of state teams to the Andover Community Center.
OTHER ITEMS
Mayor Bukkila announced a public meeting about well contamination on September 30, 2021.
She said the State has been slow to commit and communicate. Mr. Dickinson stated the MPCA
will be present at City Hall in addition to the virtual meeting participants.
Mr. Dickinson has been pushing the State to do more tests, retest, and expand the testing area.
Mayor Bukkila explained the City does not have the main role but is advocating for residents and
is just as frustrated. She said the City needs to maintain a relationship with the State so they can
pay for tests, bottled water, and water infrastructure. She expressed the importance of keeping
the message consistent and clear.
Mr. Dickinson provided an update on the process and how he is advocating for the City.
ADJOURNMENT
Motion by Holthus, Seconded by Butler, to adjourn the meeting at 9:20 p.m. Motion carried
unanimously.
Respectfully submitted,
Shari Kunza, Recording Secretary
TimeSaver Off Site Secretarial, Inc.
Agenda
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City Council Workshop
Tuesday, September 28, 2021
City Hall – Conference Rooms A & B
1. Call to Order – 6:00 p.m.
2. Continue Discussion on the 2022 Street Reconstruction/Assessment Method
Project/22-2 - Engineering
3. Fire Department Update – Fire
4. Discuss Draft 2022-2026 Capital Improvement Plan (CIP) – Administration
5. 2022 Special Revenue, Debt Service, Capital Projects, Enterprise & Internal Service Funds
Budget Distribution & Discussion – Administration
6. 2022 Budget Development Discussion/Update – Administration
7. August 2021 Community Center Update – Administration
8. Other Topics
9. Adjournment
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