Historic Preservation Commission

VILLAGE OF OSSINING Planning Department John Paul Rodrigues Ossining Operations Center 101 Route 9A, Ossining, N.Y. 10562 Tel: (914)762-6232 www.villageofossining.org HISTORIC PRESERVATION COMMISSION AGENDA Monday, October 7, 2024 7:00 PM PLEASE TAKE NOTICE: The Historic Preservation Commission will meet in person at the Ossining Operations Center, 101 Rt. 9A, Ossining, N.Y. 10562. The Commission will use a hybrid format. The public may attend in person; however, they will also continue to have the opportunity to see and hear the meeting live through Zoom, and provide comments during the appropriate time. Comments can also be emailed before and during the meeting to Plan@villageofossining.org. The meeting will be recorded, and a transcript of the meeting will be available at a later date. Zoom Link: https://us06web.zoom.us/j/95938183057 Dial-in by phone: 1+(929)205-6099 Webinar ID: 959 3818 3057 _____________________________________________________________________ I. NEW BUSINESS OF THE BOARD A. HPC 11-2024 159 Main Street, 89.19-4-30, Lozano Properties LLC, Owner, in a VC zoned district Applicant Request: Applicant is seeking a certificate of appropriateness for front facade alterations and installation of new signage for a proposed restaurant. [§270-25(G)] Date Originally Submitted: August 29, 2024 159 Main St. Building Dept. Referral (2-19-24) 159 Main St. Cover Letter (8-29-24) 159 Main St. Completed Application (8-29-24) 159 Main St. Plans (8-29-24) 159 Main St. Front Elevations, Materials, Sign Specs (8-29-24) 159 Main St. Color Photos (8-29-24) 159 Main St. Owner Authorization (8-29-24) 159 Main St. Property Deed (8-29-24) II. ADDITIONAL BUSINESS OF THE BOARD A. Historic Preservation Tax Credit Programs and Grants B. Meeting Transcript HPC Mtg. Transcript (10-7-24) Historic Preservation Commission October 7, 2024 Page 1 of 49 Agenda Item #A. VILLAGE OF OSSINING BUILDING DEPARTMENT Building Permit Referral Form SECTION: 89.19 BLOCK: 4 LOT: 30 ADDRESS: 159 Main St. Residential X Commercial Institutional Other TYPE OF IMPROVEMENT: Proposed Alterations to the First Floor Front Façade and Wall Mounted Sign for the Proposed Restaurant. OWNER: Lozano Properties LLC CONTRACTOR: N/A ARCHITECT/ENGINEER: Jorge Hernandez Zoning Variance: Parking Waiver: Conditional Use Permit: Architectural Review Board: 270-58B Board of Architectural Review – Powers and Duties Historic Preservation Committee: 270-25(G) HADD - Issuance of Certificate of Appropriateness Reason for Referral: 1) Requires Historic Preservation Committee approval for the proposed front façade alterations on the first floor and wall mounted sign for the proposed restaurant. 2) Requires Architectural Review Board approval for the proposed front façade alterations on the first floor and wall mounted sign for the proposed restaurant. Page 2 of 49 Agenda Item #A. Signature: (Building Inspector) Date: February 19, 2024 Page 3 of 49 Agenda Item #A. March 5, 2024 RECEIVED August 19, 2024 (Re-submission) Village of Ossining Planning Dept. 8-29-2024 Mr. Daniel Garbowit, Chairman HISTORICAL PRESERVATION COMMISSION Village of Ossining John-Paul Rodrigues Ossining Operations Center 101 Route 9A Ossining, NY 10562 Re: 159 Main Street, Ossining, NY 10562 (S/B/L: 89.19 – 4 – 30, Zone District: “V C” Dear Mr. Garbowit & Honorable Members of the H.P.C., As it relates to the aforementioned property location, we appear before the Board this evening on behalf of our Client, Lozano Properties, L.L.C., seeking the granting of a Certificate of Appropriateness for the installation of new signage to be located on the front façade. We are also proposing to replace and relocate the Front Entrance to the Store with a new door. Existing windows are to remain with frames to be painted Black, and the area around the new signage to be painted Gray, to match other exteriors in the area. The proposed work will NOT have a negative impact on the character of the neighborhood. To the contrary, the proposed work will enhance not only the property, but contribute to the improvement of the area, and will compliment those establishments with similar existing signage in the area. Your time this evening is very much appreciated. Please accept our thanks in advance for your consideration and anticipated approval. As always, should you or the Board Members have any additional questions or comments, please feel free to contact our office at your earliest convenience. Sincerely, Jorge B. Hernandez, R. A. President cc: Job File No.: 23-001 100 Executive Boulevard, Suite 204 Ossining, NY 10562 Ph: 914-944-3377 Page 4 of 49 Agenda Item #A. Village of Ossining Department of Planning John-Paul Rodrigues Ossining Operations Center 101 Route 9A, PO Box 1166 Ossining, NY 10562 RECEIVED (914) 762-6232 Village of Ossining www.villageofossining.org Planning Dept. 8-29-2024 _____________________________________________________________________________________ HISTORIC PRESERVATION COMMISSION APPLICATION ALL APPLICATIONS MUST HAVE A REFERRAL FROM THE BUILDING INSPECTOR. APPLICATIONS MUST BE SUBMITTED AT CITYSQUARED.COM. August 19, 2024 Date Filed:___________________ HPC 11-2024 Application No.______________________ 159 Main Street, Ossining, N.Y. Location of Project:_____________________________________________________________ 89.19 4 30 Section___________Block__________Lot__________ Zoning " VC" District:________________ Name of Owner Lozano Properties, L.L.C. (Vivian & Carlos Lozano) Address 88 Narragansett Avenue, Ossining, New York 10562 Telephone (914) 803-7535 Email Vlozano@kcleaningsvcs.com Name of Architect/Engineer Jorge B. Hernandez, R.A. (ARQ Architecture, P.C.) Address 100 Executive Blvd. Suite 204, Ossining, NY 10562 Telephone (914) 944-3377 Email rjm@arqpc.com / jb@arqpc.com Please Check Action Requested: Certificate of Appropriateness for sign/awning $125 Certificate of Appropriateness for all other actions $175 Designation of Landmark or Historic District Donation of Façade Easement Brief Description of Proposal: Proposed front facade alterations on the 1st floor and wall-mounted signage for the proposed ______________________________________________________________________________ Restaurant. ______________________________________________________________________________ ______________________________________________________________________________ ______________________________________________________________________________ ______________________________________________________________________________ 1 Page 5 of 49 Agenda Item #A. General Information  Applications must be complete and submitted to the Department of Planning by 12:00 pm on the deadline date (see attached schedule). NO EXCEPTIONS. If the application is deemed incomplete by the Department Staff you will be contacted.  Applicant must be the owner, tenant, or contract vendee.  The applicant or a representative must be present at the hearing in order for the application to be considered.  Please refer to the Village of Ossining’s Architectural Guidelines on the Village website.  If an approval is granted by the Historic Preservation Commission, no construction shall commence until all required approvals are granted and permits obtained through the Building Department. The Building Department can be contacted at (914) 941-3199.  Applicants whose property is located in a historic district must simultaneously file and application with the Board of Architectural Review.  Applications requesting designation of landmark or historic district or donation of a façade easement: If a positive recommendation from the HPC is received, the Village Board of Trustees will take up the application and will hold a public hearing. RECEIVED Village of Ossining Planning Dept. 8-29-2024 2 Page 6 of 49 Agenda Item #A. RECEIVED Village of Ossining Planning Dept. 8-29-2024 Page 7 of 49  Agenda Item #A. PROPOSED NEW RETAIL FACADE ALTERATIONS AND NEW SIGNAGE RECEIVED Village of Ossining "CULTURES Planning Dept. LOUNGE" 8-29-2024 159 MAIN ST. OSSINING, N.Y. 10562 EXISTING FRONT ELEVATION PROPOSED FRONT ELEVATION GENERAL INFO SITE LOCATION SITE LOCATION SAFE DIG Before You Dig, Drill or Blast! CALL US TOLL FREE 1-800-962-7962 NY Industrial Code Rule 753 requires no less than two working days notice, but UFPO not more than ten days notice. DRAWING LIST GENERAL NOTES RED A RCH TE S . HERNA I EB TE J OR I G RE EZ CT G ND E X C E L S IO R ST A 030424- 1 RK TE O O F NE W Y FOR HISTORIC PRESERVATION COMMISSION & A.R.B. PURPOSES ONLY Page 8 of 49  Agenda Item #A. RECEIVED Village of Ossining Planning Dept. 8-29-2024 LEONARD STREET TR MAIN S EET RED A RCH TE S . HERNA I EB TE J OR I G RE EZ CT G ND E X C E L S IO R ST A 030424- 1 RK TE O O F NE W Y FOR HISTORIC PRESERVATION COMMISSION & A.R.B. PURPOSES ONLY Page 9 of 49  Agenda Item #A. CONSTRUCTION LEGEND: RECEIVED Village of Ossining Planning Dept. 8-29-2024 AREA OF WORK CL. RED A RCH TE S . HERNA I EB TE J OR I G RE EZ CT G ND E X C E L S IO R ST A 030424- 1 RK TE O O F NE W Y FOR HISTORIC PRESERVATION COMMISSION & A.R.B. PURPOSES ONLY Page 10 of 49  Agenda Item #A. RECEIVED Village of Ossining Planning Dept. 8-29-2024 RED A RCH TE S . HERNA I EB TE J OR I G RE EZ CT G ND E X C E L S IO R ST A 030424- 1 RK TE O O F NE W Y FOR HISTORIC PRESERVATION COMMISSION & A.R.B. PURPOSES ONLY Page 11 of 49  Agenda Item #A. RECEIVED Village of Ossining Planning Dept. 8-29-2024 RED A RCH TE S . HERNA I EB TE J OR I G RE EZ CT G ND E X C E L S IO R ST A 030424- 1 RK TE O O F NE W Y FOR HISTORIC PRESERVATION COMMISSION & A.R.B. PURPOSES ONLY Page 12 of 49  Agenda Item #A. RECEIVED Village of Ossining Planning Dept. 8-29-2024 RED A RCH TE S . HERNA I EB TE J OR I G RE EZ CT G ND E X C E L S IO R ST A 030424- 1 RK TE O O F NE W Y FOR HISTORIC PRESERVATION COMMISSION & A.R.B. PURPOSES ONLY Page 13 of 49  Agenda Item #A. RECEIVED Village of Ossining Planning Dept. 8-29-2024 RED A RCH TE S . HERNA I EB TE J OR I G RE EZ CT G ND E X C E L S IO R ST A 030424- 1 RK TE O O F NE W Y FOR HISTORIC PRESERVATION COMMISSION & A.R.B. PURPOSES ONLY Page 14 of 49 Agenda Item #A. RECEIVED Village of Ossining Planning Dept. 8-29-2024 Page 15 of 49 Agenda Item #A. RECEIVED Village of Ossining Planning Dept. 8-29-2024 Page 16 of 49 Agenda Item #A. RECEIVED Village of Ossining Planning Dept. 8-29-2024 Page 17 of 49 Agenda Item #B. WEBVTT 1 00:00:23.580 --> 00:00:24.540 Planning Dept.: Hello! 2 00:20:04.070 --> 00:20:24.029 Planning Dept.: And if we can, should we take the roll call 1st and then do the flip? Yes, let's do that. So this is the what's today's date. Monday, October 7, th 2024. Meeting of the Historic Preservation Commission, the build of last night, and we'll take role. Katherine Wilson here, Jason Sia, here, Michael Baldino here, and chair garboy here. Great! 3 00:20:25.100 --> 00:20:40.640 Planning Dept.: Yes, yes, pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible with liberty and justice for all. 4 00:20:40.960 --> 00:20:47.139 Planning Dept.: Okay, so shall we begin with the hpc. 11. Dash 5 00:20:47.160 --> 00:20:50.090 Planning Dept.: 2, 0, 2, 4, 1, 59, Main Street. 6 00:20:50.840 --> 00:20:55.899 Planning Dept.: And if you wouldn't please for the record, identify yourself, and everybody can turn on their mics 7 00:20:57.160 --> 00:20:59.099 Planning Dept.: if you haven't turned on your mic. 8 00:21:00.550 --> 00:21:07.200 Planning Dept.: I don't know if these are working, Patty. So they may or may not be, but everyone can hear you at home. We practiced this earlier through the webcam mic. 9 00:21:08.197 --> 00:21:14.902 Planning Dept.: This this whole virtual meeting thing is 10 00:21:15.920 --> 00:21:16.999 Planning Dept.: lot of work. 11 00:21:17.200 --> 00:21:22.497 Planning Dept.: Alright, so obviously for your record. Identify yourself. 12 00:21:23.240 --> 00:21:30.297 Planning Dept.: this is a project. Actually, we were here in front of you with the prior tenant. That Page 18 of 49 Agenda Item #B. 13 00:21:32.180 --> 00:21:38.918 Planning Dept.: they we switch at the same place same kind of store. But it's just a different 14 00:21:40.110 --> 00:21:44.130 Planning Dept.: and and it's just the front. 15 00:21:44.170 --> 00:21:45.380 Planning Dept.: We're gonna 16 00:21:47.640 --> 00:21:50.979 Planning Dept.: that's just the existing neighborhood sites. 17 00:21:56.450 --> 00:22:00.716 Planning Dept.: This is the prior one. The name was 18 00:22:02.540 --> 00:22:08.291 Planning Dept.: picado. Since you know, this is Cultureless lounge. 19 00:22:09.210 --> 00:22:13.730 Planning Dept.: it's this is got a tenant. Yeah. 20 00:22:14.090 --> 00:22:30.810 Planning Dept.: Just curious. What's Culture lounge, gonna be? Is it a bar, or it's gonna be. It's more like a family place. Oh, it has something. Oh, so okay, the restaurant doors that open out. They're gonna have like frozen. Yoga, yeah. 21 00:22:31.090 --> 00:22:36.180 Planning Dept.: So in the other place, or this place. 22 00:22:36.390 --> 00:22:38.550 Planning Dept.: Same with you. Oh, alright! 23 00:22:40.930 --> 00:22:41.820 Planning Dept.: So 24 00:22:41.940 --> 00:22:51.055 Planning Dept.: what we're doing with the sign that is now backlit so we're gonna have almost like a docus. And that side of the 25 00:22:52.060 --> 00:22:54.919 Planning Dept.: main street has we have indirect lighting. Page 19 of 49 Agenda Item #B. 26 00:22:55.190 --> 00:22:56.980 Planning Dept.: It's a black sign. 27 00:22:58.650 --> 00:23:01.400 Planning Dept.: And then the we should switch in the 28 00:23:01.410 --> 00:23:03.670 Planning Dept.: changing the window trim 29 00:23:03.750 --> 00:23:28.730 Planning Dept.: and the glass. Are you painting the sign band, too, and repainting that because the gray looks very different if you go down to the existing. Yeah, yes, I forgot. You had paint out of the prior application. So was that color gray that was on the prior. No, it was a little bit trying to stay with the blue before. So we're using the gray. 30 00:23:28.750 --> 00:23:35.679 Planning Dept.: Oh, so it's not just for that. So also change the co- color that had been approved. Alright. 31 00:23:35.700 --> 00:23:36.760 Planning Dept.: I don't 32 00:23:37.293 --> 00:23:42.740 Planning Dept.: don't think we ever got to the approval, I think, when it was coming back. 33 00:23:43.534 --> 00:23:52.590 Planning Dept.: thought we had. No, I think you got signed off on it all. This is the one where they changed the getting rid of the reset door and bringing it up. Yeah, okay. 34 00:23:52.670 --> 00:24:01.939 Planning Dept.: I think that got approvals. But then there was the the sign ended up being a backlit sign. And then you guys were gonna come back for that. But then you decided to just unplug it. 35 00:24:01.980 --> 00:24:07.220 Planning Dept.: Yeah, okay, so if we didn't approve the backlit sign, you want one, though, for cultures. 36 00:24:07.680 --> 00:24:11.650 Planning Dept.: No, we're not. We're not asking for. Oh, I thought you said you were handling 37 00:24:11.990 --> 00:24:13.380 Planning Dept.: no, alright. 38 Page 20 of 49 Agenda Item #B. 00:24:14.630 --> 00:24:17.680 Planning Dept.: Okay. So it's a now that's a new color 39 00:24:18.390 --> 00:24:19.760 Planning Dept.: for everything. 40 00:24:19.890 --> 00:24:22.090 Planning Dept.: and that's black. 41 00:24:22.290 --> 00:24:31.009 Planning Dept.: What is that? A is it? Aluminum, anodized aluminum, black door frame? Is that what that is? 42 00:24:31.920 --> 00:24:37.369 Planning Dept.: Colored glass with black frame. So the frame is anodized black anodized aluminum. Okay, cool. 43 00:24:38.280 --> 00:24:39.070 Planning Dept.: Alright. 44 00:24:39.210 --> 00:24:43.420 Planning Dept.: Can you go back to the proposed front elevation? 45 00:24:43.570 --> 00:24:44.790 Planning Dept.: Sure, can. 46 00:24:46.660 --> 00:24:51.029 Planning Dept.: Yeah. Right? There. Okay, so that's basically the scope we're talking about. Yes. 47 00:24:51.070 --> 00:24:51.940 Planning Dept.: and 48 00:24:54.730 --> 00:25:00.640 Planning Dept.: alright. So this just I'm relatively new. So this board previously approved. 49 00:25:01.670 --> 00:25:07.380 Planning Dept.: omitting the recess and that particular door style and door front. 50 00:25:08.140 --> 00:25:17.789 Planning Dept.: Yeah, they originally wanted more. Michael. Then you see the Ko originally that whole door was gonna be, as I recall, filled up with an a logo. 51 00:25:17.880 --> 00:25:35.049 Page 21 of 49 Agenda Item #B. Planning Dept.: and then they were gonna have a logo between the 2 upper windows, as I recall, and that was turned down. So that's where we got, and the left side of the project where the culture is was not really ever part of any submission. I, as I recall. 52 00:25:35.240 --> 00:25:42.759 Planning Dept.: No, no, so so this is, I mean, as far as I'm concerned, it's just like the starting over again. Here it is. 53 00:25:42.890 --> 00:25:51.619 Planning Dept.: you know. It's a dark Gray. Is that pretty faithful Jamie to what it's gonna be that color gray? 54 00:25:52.060 --> 00:25:53.548 Planning Dept.: It's all right. And 55 00:25:54.220 --> 00:26:01.659 Planning Dept.: there's it's all. And none of this contrast, you know sort of like brackets in the in the sign banner, or whatever you want to call them. 56 00:26:01.720 --> 00:26:05.639 Planning Dept.: That's gonna be the same color as the band, right? Or is that right? 57 00:26:05.990 --> 00:26:10.990 Planning Dept.: In other words, the brackets, that vertical brackets in the sign band. 58 00:26:11.830 --> 00:26:18.330 Planning Dept.: That's yeah. Yeah. So they'll be contrasting. They'll be white. 59 00:26:18.370 --> 00:26:20.919 Planning Dept.: and the band will be great bye. 60 00:26:24.324 --> 00:26:31.750 Planning Dept.: Yes, okay, for the quarters. 61 00:26:32.340 --> 00:26:52.890 Planning Dept.: No worries. Maybe. You know, you've got a new member in the making here. All right. So I I don't have any questions, and I'll certainly open to hearing any comments from the board. Quick question. So is it going to remain as recess, front door and all that, or is it going to go back to the 62 00:26:53.320 --> 00:26:57.420 Planning Dept.: flush flush? Oh, it's staying flush! Yes, yes. 63 00:26:58.270 --> 00:27:04.650 Planning Dept.: so it's not gonna be a step back into as it is currently no, okay. So it is gonna come from. Yes, got it. Page 22 of 49 Agenda Item #B. 64 00:27:05.370 --> 00:27:16.769 Planning Dept.: I'm sorry. Yeah. I thought you were asking me, Jason, if we change it from the original, could we make it a note in the Cfo. That you know, or see if they knew that there's no change to Prior approved. 65 00:27:17.578 --> 00:27:20.169 Planning Dept.: or Kd entry short 66 00:27:21.370 --> 00:27:24.049 Planning Dept.: other than the color of the PIN. 67 00:27:24.810 --> 00:27:33.690 Planning Dept.: I have a question about the paint, so you're suggesting, just a flat gray for the entire. 68 00:27:33.700 --> 00:27:49.849 Planning Dept.: So none of the detail, the architectural detail will be, yeah, let's see, those are yeah. Some of them are damaged, or that one's damaged. 69 00:27:50.481 --> 00:28:08.239 Planning Dept.: I don't even know what they are. Are they really original? And what is the top of the building painted like right now? Because I know it's just a brick red. It looks yeah, where the deep, the architectural detail at the top. What does that look like you mean up here? Yeah. Oh, I don't know. Actually, I never thought to ask. 70 00:28:08.750 --> 00:28:10.409 Planning Dept.: Try to do a street view. Yeah. 71 00:28:14.026 --> 00:28:17.380 Planning Dept.: something to. 72 00:28:18.210 --> 00:28:24.780 Planning Dept.: Were you gonna remove those dentals and I'll call them dentals for lack of a better word. Brackets? 73 00:28:25.573 --> 00:28:28.559 Planning Dept.: What are they? Do you know? Are they? 74 00:28:29.026 --> 00:28:34.220 Planning Dept.: Were they some kind of original decoration, because some of them are damaged or missing. 75 00:28:34.520 --> 00:28:46.929 Planning Dept.: Oh, there it is! No. Where is it? Okay? Think that painting it 76 Page 23 of 49 Agenda Item #B. 00:28:47.130 --> 00:28:50.839 Planning Dept.: black Gray would be a real, especially only half of it. 77 00:28:51.190 --> 00:28:53.469 Planning Dept.: Yeah, I think it has to stay. 78 00:28:53.540 --> 00:29:04.359 Planning Dept.: Do they own the entire building? Wait a minute. No, it's this, and then this stays the way it is. Is this owned by the same owner. 79 00:29:05.640 --> 00:29:10.270 Planning Dept.: Well, that's a very good point, Catherine. It would end up now being bijulicating. 80 00:29:10.320 --> 00:29:13.310 Planning Dept.: Yeah, I have the same issue with entry door. 81 00:29:15.650 --> 00:29:22.139 Planning Dept.: Well, the entry door here we approved. 82 00:29:22.640 --> 00:29:31.759 Planning Dept.: All you talking about that one? No, the one where it says for rent. Oh, yeah, you can't really see it because the grates down. But if you look at the 83 00:29:31.780 --> 00:29:35.940 Planning Dept.: door on the right, which I didn't even realize was part of the old building. 84 00:29:36.870 --> 00:29:40.369 Planning Dept.: changing the whole facade and getting rid of the recess. 85 00:29:40.560 --> 00:29:43.667 Planning Dept.: The one on the left hand side is a lot deeper. 86 00:29:44.170 --> 00:29:45.390 Planning Dept.: but 87 00:29:45.560 --> 00:29:50.980 Planning Dept.: there is symmetry there that happens with the recess and just the rhythm of 88 00:29:51.310 --> 00:29:52.490 Planning Dept.: the windows. 89 Page 24 of 49 Agenda Item #B. 00:29:53.350 --> 00:30:06.139 Planning Dept.: No, it's a very good point. I'm glad it got brought up we'd be by. We'd be changing the basic appearance of the building if we gave you a different color, because now it reads as one bill, if you could zoom out so we could see the whole building again. 90 00:30:06.410 --> 00:30:12.109 Planning Dept.: It's 1 it reads as one building, and yet, if we do what you're proposing, it won't. 91 00:30:13.700 --> 00:30:20.170 Planning Dept.: so we will maintain the we'll propose to the client, we should discuss another. We will maintain the weight. 92 00:30:20.230 --> 00:30:33.690 Planning Dept.: So basically repairing this and repainting it. That's 2 different people who have to undergo that expense. It's 2 different buildings. Huh? That's interesting. It's like a condo. It's like a big condo. 93 00:30:34.150 --> 00:30:41.739 Planning Dept.: Alright. So, Catherine, that's a good point. So should we say, see, these are all monochromatic. They don't contrast. If you go down 94 00:30:42.060 --> 00:30:48.960 Planning Dept.: they're contrasting. So I guess you could say the precedent was they were just part of the same color 95 00:30:49.130 --> 00:30:55.770 Planning Dept.: as the cornice as the sign bandages is up atop. See? The this is seems like it was more of a 96 00:30:57.010 --> 00:31:04.169 Planning Dept.: non original intervention. Then, if you go up to the top, if you look between the right and the left storefronts. 97 00:31:04.570 --> 00:31:10.620 Planning Dept.: the storefront on the right has got that gray that matches the the dentals for lack of a better word, but the 98 00:31:11.450 --> 00:31:17.059 Planning Dept.: the pedestrian band. Then you get the light blue on the left hand side, which changes 99 00:31:17.200 --> 00:31:32.409 Planning Dept.: demarcuting the different different storefronts. But then the overall up top is white. So at some point it was painted. What the original color is, who knows? Well, it was, you know, up here, 1858. I'm just saying I'm assuming that this maybe is more 100 00:31:32.600 --> 00:31:43.280 Planning Dept.: original than down below at the sign bandials at the bottom of the brackets. Those are a dark ray, too. Page 25 of 49 Agenda Item #B. 101 00:31:43.940 --> 00:31:44.825 Planning Dept.: Well. 102 00:31:45.760 --> 00:31:48.667 Planning Dept.: I I don't think that's so critical for the 103 00:31:49.110 --> 00:32:02.889 Planning Dept.: The applicant, if it resorts, reverts back to the color that exists. Well, if we make the gray dent, if we make it what we call the dentals, which are these square 104 00:32:02.960 --> 00:32:08.420 Planning Dept.: things, one of which is they're not really dentals, but I don't know what else to call them at the moment. 105 00:32:08.890 --> 00:32:19.460 Planning Dept.: If we did anything to make them all monochromatic, then this half would not be this half so I guess, consistent with that. This would remain black and this color. 106 00:32:19.912 --> 00:32:26.970 Planning Dept.: There wasn't that part of jeez. We gotta look at the old application because it seems this seems like deja vu all over again. 107 00:32:27.100 --> 00:32:33.887 Planning Dept.: I think we as far as the color goes. I thought we 108 00:32:34.990 --> 00:32:35.820 Planning Dept.: huh! 109 00:32:36.210 --> 00:32:43.770 Planning Dept.: Alright, maybe that didn't get addressed. Well, yeah. But when we look at the the building elevation it's always been the one section, not 110 00:32:43.790 --> 00:32:53.540 Planning Dept.: realizing that it's yeah, yeah, no, it's a good point that brought up. It's a very good point. Okay? Well, so then, if this gets colored 111 00:32:53.780 --> 00:33:04.519 Planning Dept.: light gray, then this all this stuff would be the same as well, I presume, if you go back to the to the existing view. Yeah, everything is the same. 112 00:33:04.780 --> 00:33:07.000 Planning Dept.: You know this trim. Page 26 of 49 Agenda Item #B. 113 00:33:07.050 --> 00:33:11.880 Planning Dept.: that gray do. Those are those like still there? And are they gonna remain. 114 00:33:12.530 --> 00:33:17.129 Planning Dept.: these lights? Oh, I so I assume. Are they remaining? They're remaining right. 115 00:33:17.510 --> 00:33:22.620 Planning Dept.: Yeah, I don't think we don't think it didn't look like it. Oh. 116 00:33:22.780 --> 00:33:25.360 Planning Dept.: are you you taking them down? 117 00:33:25.400 --> 00:33:28.140 Planning Dept.: No, I think there was some information on there. 118 00:33:28.150 --> 00:33:33.729 Planning Dept.: We're not touching those lights. Alright. So you'd make a note that the lights remain and get refurbished. 119 00:33:34.550 --> 00:33:37.720 Planning Dept.: And so it's just to recapture. So we are. 120 00:33:37.870 --> 00:33:39.670 Planning Dept.: I'm keeping the 121 00:33:40.090 --> 00:33:43.559 Planning Dept.: the accent, the dentals dark. 122 00:33:43.670 --> 00:33:51.580 Planning Dept.: We keep in the background. Why, it's too much next door and keep it there right? Maybe, unless you can convince the next door neighbor if they want to paint their facade, too. 123 00:33:52.199 --> 00:34:01.189 Planning Dept.: Yeah. But it's gonna look kind of weird. I have kind of a similar question about the transcending, though that's that way. So like 124 00:34:01.710 --> 00:34:03.720 Planning Dept.: the store next door. 125 00:34:03.800 --> 00:34:08.939 Page 27 of 49 Agenda Item #B. Planning Dept.: clearly like that whole storefront was replaced. And there's like a consistency 126 00:34:08.980 --> 00:34:11.789 Planning Dept.: to the windows and transoms there 127 00:34:12.130 --> 00:34:13.230 Planning Dept.: and then 128 00:34:13.409 --> 00:34:19.789 Planning Dept.: the left. So there's the same thing with that arch and keystone on every one of the window bays. 129 00:34:20.050 --> 00:34:25.009 Planning Dept.: and it goes back into that recess and is on the door in the recess. But, 130 00:34:25.449 --> 00:34:29.279 Planning Dept.: David, might you propose? We just have a clear transom 131 00:34:29.620 --> 00:34:30.560 Planning Dept.: which 132 00:34:32.250 --> 00:34:34.979 Planning Dept.: I don't know. I just think you kind of lose the rhythm. 133 00:34:35.199 --> 00:34:45.059 Planning Dept.: I'm not sure I followed you, Michael. What would you change when you're saying that you get those 3 arches at the top. 134 00:34:45.159 --> 00:34:49.826 Planning Dept.: and now you know the arches are but the door, the door loses it. 135 00:34:50.590 --> 00:34:53.380 Planning Dept.: Well, I just that's it. I'm just not sure whether 136 00:34:54.193 --> 00:35:05.869 Planning Dept.: it can do what you're talking about it. It can. It can say anything it wants and make any decision so long as it's within our mandate. What was our intent to try to 137 00:35:06.530 --> 00:35:26.519 Planning Dept.: some of the architectural integrity that was there, or well, that's what we're supposed to be doing, and any changes that are necessary. We have to also be careful, because if we bring that out more, then next door, they already have taken that detail out if you next door the the salon. Page 28 of 49 Agenda Item #B. 138 00:35:26.560 --> 00:35:34.270 Planning Dept.: Yeah, like the arches are all yeah, the arches, or they were never there. And they were added in on the left. Who knows what was historic? 139 00:35:34.990 --> 00:35:41.089 Planning Dept.: I I for that reason, I guess the arched issue isn't so important to me, anyways, because it's so different. 140 00:35:41.320 --> 00:35:48.100 Planning Dept.: and it exists now as an arch to tell you to take it out when you know who knows whether it was original or not. 141 00:35:48.240 --> 00:35:54.370 Planning Dept.: But I think, in my own opinion, that's look at, Catherine said. Look at it again. As a whole building is very important, and 142 00:35:54.410 --> 00:35:58.720 Planning Dept.: the paint color the paint scheme should match what's on the other side 143 00:35:58.830 --> 00:36:02.480 Planning Dept.: with contrasting dental colors, keeping the lights. 144 00:36:02.730 --> 00:36:12.280 Planning Dept.: And hopefully, you know, maybe when you go to paint this, the sign band, somebody will paint the entire cordon. You know the entablature up there. 145 00:36:12.660 --> 00:36:14.000 Planning Dept.: You're gonna do that 146 00:36:14.280 --> 00:36:18.609 Planning Dept.: is that in your no one knows is that it? I don't know that? 147 00:36:18.840 --> 00:36:20.570 Planning Dept.: Who can actually 148 00:36:21.010 --> 00:36:23.239 Planning Dept.: so could you go back to the drawing? I 149 00:36:23.970 --> 00:36:24.680 Planning Dept.: the 150 00:36:25.390 --> 00:36:28.039 Page 29 of 49 Agenda Item #B. Planning Dept.: so! The new 151 00:36:28.230 --> 00:36:35.469 Planning Dept.: door is flush with the windows. 152 00:36:36.350 --> 00:36:44.250 Planning Dept.: demolish that sort of corridor to the in those walls. Okay, you go to the plan. That's the best way to answer it. I think 153 00:36:45.840 --> 00:36:52.480 Planning Dept.: there is a plan. Right? That's what I hear. Yeah, there, there's things. 154 00:36:57.800 --> 00:37:06.709 Planning Dept.: There you go. There's the existing. There's the new one. Yeah, that's good. I wonder if those windows are original, just based on 155 00:37:06.800 --> 00:37:10.609 Planning Dept.: how long that store was there in the second floor. 156 00:37:10.750 --> 00:37:13.750 Planning Dept.: And when the salon did updates and all that. 157 00:37:14.310 --> 00:37:20.039 Planning Dept.: well, they'd have to be research, I I imagine, and then it would still look different than 158 00:37:20.670 --> 00:37:24.500 Planning Dept.: we'll go to the plan. That's what we why, we're there, please. 159 00:37:24.790 --> 00:37:27.799 Planning Dept.: They'll answer a big question about recess. 160 00:37:29.320 --> 00:37:36.270 Planning Dept.: Yeah. So we are. Yeah, it's that existing versus proposed. Yeah, that's the the red showing what we're in the margin. 161 00:37:36.370 --> 00:37:38.102 Planning Dept.: So right now, 162 00:37:39.470 --> 00:37:45.210 Planning Dept.: yeah, there's not gonna be a store internal storefront, right? 163 Page 30 of 49 Agenda Item #B. 00:37:45.840 --> 00:37:51.493 Planning Dept.: And so that arch is that arch right now above the door that's being demolished? Or is it in line with the. 164 00:37:52.010 --> 00:37:56.619 Planning Dept.: So it's in line with the recess. So we're not gonna deal with it. Anyway. 165 00:37:58.050 --> 00:37:59.290 Planning Dept.: it's gonna be gone. 166 00:38:01.560 --> 00:38:06.310 Planning Dept.: and any everything. If you can see those double doors. That's not part of our purview. 167 00:38:06.930 --> 00:38:09.020 Planning Dept.: It's really what's on the street. 168 00:38:10.210 --> 00:38:17.460 Planning Dept.: Yeah, everything on the side is significant change to the architecture of that very old building. 169 00:38:21.140 --> 00:38:33.030 Planning Dept.: I mean, we're keeping the okay. Would you say you'd want to see a recess? Tremendous amount of area to inside? So you know. 170 00:38:34.340 --> 00:38:42.579 Planning Dept.: Well, of course, problematically, objectively. You know this, those storefront areas, the shop windows that they had had a different tenant. 171 00:38:42.750 --> 00:38:50.679 Planning Dept.: We presumably have no benefit from the for the new. It's gonna be a restaurant this year. 172 00:38:51.140 --> 00:38:56.400 Planning Dept.: Yeah. But I understand what you're saying. I'm just thinking from 173 00:38:56.790 --> 00:38:59.070 Planning Dept.: architecturally. 174 00:38:59.520 --> 00:39:05.780 Planning Dept.: Well, I think that you know, changing the making the colors uniform to neighbors. Very good point. 175 00:39:05.890 --> 00:39:08.026 Planning Dept.: That will help. And 176 Page 31 of 49 Agenda Item #B. 00:39:11.190 --> 00:39:16.880 Planning Dept.: keeping the lights which are not indicated. That's something needs to be indicated. 177 00:39:19.360 --> 00:39:23.819 Planning Dept.: do we? I feel we're ready to vote on it now, or we want to have more discussion on it. 178 00:39:24.370 --> 00:39:28.199 Planning Dept.: Is there anyone who has new, like new comments about this. 179 00:39:28.790 --> 00:39:31.979 Planning Dept.: Wants to, you know. Have it revised, or 180 00:39:33.730 --> 00:39:35.460 Planning Dept.: ready to go in it now 181 00:39:37.170 --> 00:39:48.899 Planning Dept.: I'll wait to hear a motion. We wait for a motion. Right? I mean, what? What's the is there a spec for the door? The new door? It's just an aluminum door with black. 182 00:39:49.340 --> 00:39:59.399 Planning Dept.: Is that. What's in the salon? Similar? Something like that? Yeah, like, there's no there's no kick plate on the side lights like it. 183 00:39:59.510 --> 00:40:03.409 Planning Dept.: I feel like there's a few little subtle changes that can make. 184 00:40:03.480 --> 00:40:06.849 Planning Dept.: Oh, I see your point. Yeah. There's no panel below the storefront. 185 00:40:07.230 --> 00:40:12.770 Planning Dept.: hey? Can we go back to the full view of the building, Maddie, of the whole building. 186 00:40:12.860 --> 00:40:23.540 Planning Dept.: Yeah, yeah, there you go. So it always has. That's a good point, too. It always has a panel below the sill. If you submit on the door next door, I think it has 187 00:40:23.630 --> 00:40:29.759 Planning Dept.: next door left next row, right. 188 00:40:30.500 --> 00:40:31.929 Planning Dept.: There is no. Page 32 of 49 Agenda Item #B. 189 00:40:32.760 --> 00:40:36.040 Planning Dept.: you know. We are keeping the same in the front. 190 00:40:36.050 --> 00:40:37.579 Planning Dept.: and then the door. 191 00:40:38.210 --> 00:40:40.509 Planning Dept.: When were you planning to open? By the way. 192 00:40:42.510 --> 00:40:44.115 Planning Dept.: tomorrow? 193 00:40:46.140 --> 00:41:04.619 Planning Dept.: Why did you do all the work already? Something else, and it's a long lead item to order the window. But anyway so there! Now, if you move to the left of the building, Matt, if you wouldn't mind walk to the building in question. Yeah. So there are the panels under the sill 194 00:41:04.710 --> 00:41:13.340 Planning Dept.: that would now be taken out. Are you sure I thought it was the windows coming. Oh, they are there. Okay, yeah. 195 00:41:13.430 --> 00:41:27.539 Planning Dept.: He's talking about the silent when we get rid of the recess front. Then when that door moves forward. The sidelights that are now even on the side are now just floor, full light glass floor to ceiling. 196 00:41:27.730 --> 00:41:28.730 Planning Dept.: It's start. 197 00:41:29.030 --> 00:41:30.300 Planning Dept.: you know we can. 198 00:41:30.350 --> 00:41:31.990 Planning Dept.: Who does run more on that 199 00:41:32.140 --> 00:41:35.360 Planning Dept.: I think I have. I have a feeling 200 00:41:35.748 --> 00:41:40.149 Planning Dept.: if we had a new drawing it would be easier to approve it. 201 00:41:40.190 --> 00:41:49.719 Page 33 of 49 Agenda Item #B. Planning Dept.: based on the comments we have. If we write everything down now it it I'm still not sure we catch it all, or we give you clear instruction. 202 00:41:50.020 --> 00:41:56.709 Planning Dept.: Like to see photographs of the existing not with, you know, not just photographs of existing door. 203 00:41:56.950 --> 00:42:19.820 Planning Dept.: You know the door to the store, not through the metal grate, because I'm just curious. I've been in there, but I certainly don't remember if they have those details, or if they had replaced it, that door in the seventies or something. Who knows? It looks fairly original, too. It's significantly deeper than the yeah. And I just wonder if it has any of that 204 00:42:19.820 --> 00:42:30.040 Planning Dept.: trim work any of that original detail. Yeah, you can see that on the up here on the side, going down, there's an arch going in towards back of the door. 205 00:42:30.040 --> 00:42:38.549 Planning Dept.: There's the door in the back, and I'm assuming it's all symmetrical. 206 00:42:41.120 --> 00:42:50.080 Planning Dept.: Alright. So it sounds like we're gonna ask for a drawing that illustrates the comments and the solution we talked about. 207 00:42:50.150 --> 00:42:59.069 Planning Dept.: And I'm I imagine, or I believe right now we've decided number One. The drawing should reflect lights that stay 208 00:42:59.470 --> 00:43:04.539 Planning Dept.: the drawing should reflect the color scheme that exists now in shine salon. 209 00:43:05.127 --> 00:43:08.499 Planning Dept.: It's close. I guess it's an old pink color. But 210 00:43:08.993 --> 00:43:17.930 Planning Dept.: I'm not sure. I mean, it's gonna be some difference, because you can't mention exactly, because that's the other thing. Can't mention exactly, because that pink 211 00:43:18.080 --> 00:43:34.430 Planning Dept.: where shine salon is is probably very old, and I'm not sure what color we we won't. You know what color we asking for? You get a sample of the shine salon sign band background paint, and that's the color we paint 212 00:43:35.100 --> 00:43:36.370 Planning Dept.: your part. Page 34 of 49 Agenda Item #B. 213 00:43:36.870 --> 00:43:39.189 Planning Dept.: And I guess it'll be a little different. 214 00:43:39.330 --> 00:43:45.589 Planning Dept.: But be a significant difference, because the brackets are, gonna break it up. 215 00:43:46.147 --> 00:43:53.629 Planning Dept.: And I think another thing to add is to the drawing is, you gotta show the building in its in its whole, in its context. Not just 216 00:43:54.030 --> 00:44:02.246 Planning Dept.: yeah. That's that's a very good point. At 1st glance, you know. You forget that the whole thing one billing. That's why it was great. Catherine mentioned that. And 217 00:44:02.890 --> 00:44:03.810 Planning Dept.: so 218 00:44:04.010 --> 00:44:06.499 Planning Dept.: are we. Are we saying that we would. 219 00:44:07.388 --> 00:44:12.400 Planning Dept.: I'm gathering comments right now, feedback. So one would be lights to be kept. 220 00:44:14.610 --> 00:44:16.470 Planning Dept.: Let's get this resolved 221 00:44:16.960 --> 00:44:19.210 Planning Dept.: 2 is paint 222 00:44:20.490 --> 00:44:25.589 Planning Dept.: for Jake, for that's the eastern section, eastern half 223 00:44:29.750 --> 00:44:31.010 Planning Dept.: a building. 224 00:44:34.630 --> 00:44:37.010 Planning Dept.: The other thing we said was that 225 00:44:37.700 --> 00:44:49.340 Planning Dept.: the store for? We want a new study for the flush entry door to have transom panels that have a lower Page 35 of 49 Agenda Item #B. kick panel. Is that what we said. 226 00:44:49.370 --> 00:44:52.019 Planning Dept.: Yeah, so new entry 227 00:44:54.740 --> 00:45:09.400 Planning Dept.: with kick, I will just say to to match adjacent with with well, with new entry, with kick, panel on, actually on doors and side lights. Yeah, on door and side lights 228 00:45:14.920 --> 00:45:22.969 Planning Dept.: there any other substantial I would say, provide details of doors and side lights at the 229 00:45:23.700 --> 00:45:30.610 Planning Dept.: well let their heart to their eyes. There's something didn't you do something? I think, Jamie? Well, I mean, I think the architectural drawings is 230 00:45:30.650 --> 00:45:35.650 Planning Dept.: show the details of how that's all going back together with, you know, the trim and everything else on the side 231 00:45:36.080 --> 00:46:01.709 Planning Dept.: you're replacing the windows. So see the detail of the new replacement. Oh, side the windows on the side. Now they go into the frame. I I have. I'm sorry to interrupt Jason, but getting back to the door and side lights. You'll see the door as he's proposing it in black, which would now be. We're saying it'll all be gray right. Everything will be gray. The way the Kokd door is, is that what we're saying, or 232 00:46:01.720 --> 00:46:03.090 Planning Dept.: it's being done? 233 00:46:03.460 --> 00:46:11.370 Planning Dept.: What are we saying? We're not saying anything about it. Well, let's, I guess we have to resolve this because 234 00:46:12.430 --> 00:46:13.360 Planning Dept.: I mean 235 00:46:13.560 --> 00:46:24.269 Planning Dept.: a spec of the door that's going to be used. Yeah. And and a detail of that where the new door joins the existing facade. 236 00:46:24.320 --> 00:46:32.349 Planning Dept.: Alright, certainly that has to be done anyways, when you build it. So that's a good point. The door itself, though whether it's black or green or purple. Page 36 of 49 Agenda Item #B. 237 00:46:32.460 --> 00:46:38.690 Planning Dept.: is essentially the same style as the Ko is that Ko or Kd door? 238 00:46:39.342 --> 00:46:49.730 Planning Dept.: It doesn't really have, you know any kind of a style and rail panel to it? Yeah, Michael, your point was the sidelight. Yeah. 239 00:46:49.910 --> 00:46:50.715 Planning Dept.: and 240 00:46:52.100 --> 00:46:56.960 Planning Dept.: so the side light will have panels, but not the door. 241 00:46:57.670 --> 00:47:04.880 Planning Dept.: Look, kick, panel, and I'm getting still back to the color. So if everything changes to the color, is that door black. 242 00:47:05.050 --> 00:47:29.819 Planning Dept.: or is, it depends on how their color scheme is going to go. Yes. Well, no, I'm saying it depends. You're gonna have to come back. So I think it's up to the the owner and the architect to sort of. Well, no, I'm just. I'm suggesting something else. We're here to make an approval and tell them what we, what we think is appropriate. So is it okay to have a contrasting black door and sidelight that's flush with the facade 243 00:47:30.160 --> 00:47:39.470 Planning Dept.: as opposed to keeping it consistent with the color we approve, or actually the Ko the Kd door. Can you go back to the picture? This? 244 00:47:39.910 --> 00:47:42.090 Planning Dept.: I think that's an existing wood door. Right? 245 00:47:42.390 --> 00:47:43.400 Planning Dept.: And 246 00:47:43.510 --> 00:47:47.989 Planning Dept.: yeah, that's so, alright. So basically. 247 00:47:49.320 --> 00:47:50.220 Planning Dept.: yeah. 248 00:47:50.580 --> 00:48:06.769 Planning Dept.: this this thing gets back to the color. I thought we had approved a color scheme in your prior approval, Page 37 of 49 Agenda Item #B. and maybe what we have to do is just revisit that application and not reinvent the wheel. Whatever we approve, we have to stand by, and I believe we had color in there for everything. 249 00:48:07.672 --> 00:48:08.697 Planning Dept.: Is it? 250 00:48:09.500 --> 00:48:13.070 Planning Dept.: We do think? Then we, I think. 251 00:48:13.675 --> 00:48:21.700 Planning Dept.: have my old. We have the old agenda here. Is there a way to quickly look that way? 252 00:48:21.780 --> 00:48:23.480 Planning Dept.: It wasn't in May 253 00:48:24.760 --> 00:48:41.500 Planning Dept.: I can show what was in the application packet. I don't have the certificate of appropriateness. May 9.th There's May 9, th right? So here's the meeting. Agenda. Hold second. 11, 2 0 2, 4, 254 00:48:42.270 --> 00:48:44.329 Planning Dept.: 59 right here. 255 00:48:44.490 --> 00:48:45.460 Planning Dept.: Very good. 256 00:48:45.580 --> 00:48:59.560 Planning Dept.: Alright. So what did we? What did we have done that we approved? Is there a certificate of appropriate? Well, that I mean, that's what I'm saying. I can show you what was in the application packet. I don't have ready access to this. So it looked like it was. They were just moving everything forward. 257 00:48:59.700 --> 00:49:02.410 Planning Dept.: I think the color scheme is remaining 258 00:49:03.540 --> 00:49:09.520 Planning Dept.: didn't sound like, didn't we? What we should? What I'm saying is, do we have a C of A on that 259 00:49:09.700 --> 00:49:22.069 Planning Dept.: project? What I'm saying is, one exists. I can't access. So what we certainly, if we have a C of a certainly, then the applicant has it so. I think long story short, is obviously. 260 00:49:22.540 --> 00:49:31.340 Planning Dept.: you know, we don't want it to look like 2 separate buildings. In other words, the other owners building Page 38 of 49 Agenda Item #B. in your building at the street level, just because that's not the way it looks up above. 261 00:49:31.630 --> 00:49:38.359 Planning Dept.: There was a C of A that was issued. We don't. I don't think we're here to reinvent the wheel, whatever we approve for you, we should stand by. 262 00:49:38.510 --> 00:49:44.880 Planning Dept.: So come back. And with that Cma in mind which may, I think, did address colors. 263 00:49:45.454 --> 00:49:50.069 Planning Dept.: You know. Let's see, you know what, how you merge the 2, 264 00:49:50.640 --> 00:49:54.909 Planning Dept.: you know. Take what was approved, and merge with what you want to do now 265 00:49:56.271 --> 00:49:58.579 Planning Dept.: think that's my my only 266 00:49:58.870 --> 00:50:01.950 Planning Dept.: having them matching the colors. I think 267 00:50:03.170 --> 00:50:05.340 Planning Dept.: they can be similar colors, but 268 00:50:05.650 --> 00:50:07.870 Planning Dept.: it'd be hard to match 269 00:50:08.500 --> 00:50:21.109 Planning Dept.: an existing color. We don't know, because then we're gonna be playing catch. Because what happened? I think that's what I was saying. It's an old white color, great color. I don't know what it is exactly, and it's a shame that 270 00:50:21.220 --> 00:50:27.449 Planning Dept.: the whole thing's not being done across the whole building. So I see your point, and that's something I was raising, too. 271 00:50:27.910 --> 00:50:38.750 Planning Dept.: I think we address colors in the C of A, and you know I never thought to look it up before tonight's meeting and I guess nobody else did either. So 272 00:50:40.190 --> 00:50:46.169 Planning Dept.: I would say, that's the best way to proceed, because, you know, we issue if we issued a C of a whatever we did. Page 39 of 49 Agenda Item #B. 273 00:50:46.470 --> 00:50:54.059 Planning Dept.: That's what we did, and that's a guide, guideline, for you know how to treat the rest of the building. Obviously. 274 00:50:54.070 --> 00:50:59.920 Planning Dept.: I think you're on notice, generally speaking, that we don't want it to be distinctively one half a building. 275 00:51:00.020 --> 00:51:03.640 Planning Dept.: and leave it to you to come back with us. 276 00:51:04.930 --> 00:51:12.760 Planning Dept.: Does that make sense as the way to adjourn it? And along with details of the doors and the side lights? Is there anything else 277 00:51:15.240 --> 00:51:18.269 Planning Dept.: I'm just reading. These are the minutes from me. 278 00:51:18.570 --> 00:51:22.020 Planning Dept.: April meeting where this property was discussed. 279 00:51:22.907 --> 00:51:26.610 Planning Dept.: Everyone see that having zoom 280 00:51:26.660 --> 00:51:27.830 Planning Dept.: issues here. 281 00:51:29.720 --> 00:51:36.609 Planning Dept.: there's 4 space would be an eating establishment. Picado. One sign identified a second circular sign be affixed in the building. 282 00:51:36.670 --> 00:51:50.910 Planning Dept.: which members asked how to sign at the front address would be backlighted. How far out the letters would protrude, he would have requested information from the main meeting. Questions were also asked about the front door to the establishment single be 2 doors and about the doors finish 283 00:51:51.209 --> 00:52:08.559 Planning Dept.: samples would be available at the May meeting. Agreed to adjourn. So maybe you don't have a certificate, because I don't see it in the May in the minutes from the May meeting that this was closed out. Yeah, because I think I kind of recall. We wanted to see some of the details of all that. Yes. 284 00:52:09.190 --> 00:52:12.390 Page 40 of 49 Agenda Item #B. Planning Dept.: alright. So I was wrong about a C of A so 285 00:52:13.281 --> 00:52:19.059 Planning Dept.: there we have it. It's we're just catching up down some unresolved issues that never came back again. 286 00:52:24.280 --> 00:52:40.569 Planning Dept.: yeah, cause now looking at it with you know, fresh eyes and looking at it from a hole, looking at a restrictive. You're like, Oh, wait a minute, because I remember because I thought we're just looking at the side. I think that the sign became a big part of our discussion. Yeah, yeah. So the K and D element got approved. But this element 287 00:52:40.770 --> 00:52:46.730 Planning Dept.: kind of was left open. Yeah, yes. But where did we? If we approved, it would have been a Cna for that. 288 00:52:46.770 --> 00:53:16.269 Planning Dept.: for the Kd. Side, which I think was in like December, right? I mean. So there was a C of a issue, because, yeah, because when he came back, Kd, there on the wall right now, he had brought up the fact that the Kd. Sign was backlit and forgot to talk about that at the meeting I so I remember all of that and I'm pretty confident that after a couple runs the the K. And D elements all eventually got approved, and you should have a Cma for that. Unfortunately, Stewart's not here, and he might be helpful in this instance. 289 00:53:16.290 --> 00:53:20.870 Planning Dept.: No, no, no, it's no 290 00:53:21.511 --> 00:53:24.570 Planning Dept.: think that was the solution. 291 00:53:25.940 --> 00:53:30.710 Planning Dept.: Alright. So the applicant can get the C of a obviously 292 00:53:30.830 --> 00:53:38.639 Planning Dept.: and we'll we'll be in touch about. We'll incorporate that. But just to recap, I think it sounds like the consensus is 293 00:53:39.232 --> 00:53:48.670 Planning Dept.: that the drawing will reflect the existing lights to be kept, and re. I would hope, maybe refurbished if they're not in good shape, but repainted. 294 00:53:48.680 --> 00:53:50.260 Planning Dept.: The paint. 295 00:53:50.530 --> 00:54:05.540 Planning Dept.: we say paint per Eastern half of building. So maybe, then that is something that we never really did address, you know, before. And now the question is, do we go back to what the applicant now shows, which is a Page 41 of 49 Agenda Item #B. contrasting color 296 00:54:06.300 --> 00:54:08.259 Planning Dept.: in the sign band 297 00:54:08.630 --> 00:54:13.030 Planning Dept.: and in the storefronts? Or do we try to. 298 00:54:13.100 --> 00:54:15.719 Planning Dept.: you know, match as best as possible 299 00:54:16.615 --> 00:54:17.460 Planning Dept.: everything. 300 00:54:17.520 --> 00:54:35.160 Planning Dept.: And as I was saying before, I think we know you put a new coat of paint, even if it gets close to that existing color on the right. It's not going to be exact. No, I know. I mean, you're also. Then you have years of, you know, grime and appreciate that fact. But you know, when I was here when I did my house 301 00:54:35.460 --> 00:54:37.060 Planning Dept.: 10 plus years ago. 302 00:54:37.110 --> 00:54:38.380 Planning Dept.: you know, I remember 303 00:54:38.440 --> 00:54:41.629 Planning Dept.: the original chair, and basically said, You know, I did a very simple 304 00:54:41.660 --> 00:54:54.769 Planning Dept.: elevations and plans and whatnot, and I got chat size for it to say, you know, you need to show a lot of the detail that's on the existing building, which I think some of the existing drawing. The drawings presented thus far are missing, which would provide a lot more 305 00:54:56.040 --> 00:55:03.009 Planning Dept.: but helpful information as far as the drawing goes, for us to weigh in on. You know, the color and the and the paint scheme that's happening. 306 00:55:06.007 --> 00:55:09.562 Planning Dept.: think the challenge we're building here is 307 00:55:10.500 --> 00:55:12.389 Planning Dept.: is the insecting this. Page 42 of 49 Agenda Item #B. 308 00:55:12.510 --> 00:55:34.509 Planning Dept.: It's 1 larger area. But it's when it 1st came through. I just I just remember I was like, Oh, yeah, it's that. And then when we looked at them like, Oh, wait! It's the whole. It's a double y, not not just a single storefront like the 18, you know. Basically. Yeah, to to the point, is, it really would have been a better. I mean, it'd be easier to talk about it right now if. 309 00:55:34.580 --> 00:55:51.679 Planning Dept.: of course, the entire building we're drawing. And we saw the contrast on paper between the proposed, and the right that's existing, I mean, cause I mean, when you look at this here and you look at the photos, I mean, there's a lot more detail going on here. 310 00:55:51.680 --> 00:56:10.050 Planning Dept.: Then if you go scroll up a bit, it's missing a lot of the details. So it's you're not seeing that it continues this way, too. There's a lot more character in the building that's not expressed in the drawing that you see in the photo. And we're sort of kind of. Think one of the Elizabeth 311 00:56:10.130 --> 00:56:14.790 Planning Dept.: repeating the element, the element to kind of separate the 2 buildings. 312 00:56:15.340 --> 00:56:41.460 Planning Dept.: Could you go back to existing street view, please, Maddie, I'm sorry to have to keep it. So you would actually want to take over more than half with your new color. Yeah, the other thing I think you show on your drawing. You have this detail here in the middle. I don't think it exists, does it? No, no, I think that at 1 point we were trying to kind of separate. But basically, if we followed your drawing exactly, the wood gray color would be including this right? 313 00:56:41.550 --> 00:56:48.239 Planning Dept.: So now you'd have more than half of them, even if we wanted to bifurcate the building. It doesn't really work very well, because 314 00:56:48.330 --> 00:56:50.549 Planning Dept.: this gives you more than half. 315 00:56:50.760 --> 00:57:06.600 Planning Dept.: You know. It just doesn't. If if I can, you go back to your proposed elevation, I think you were gonna paint that right? Yeah, you're gonna paint that. So it doesn't really work to bifurcate it, you know, to split it in half hope. The applicant can understand that. You know, look very strange. 316 00:57:06.620 --> 00:57:09.519 Planning Dept.: So we have to come up with something else. 317 00:57:10.870 --> 00:57:16.879 Planning Dept.: Look at it as a whole, and with the eye towards you. Know this is, you know, the tenant sign, and I get that. Page 43 of 49 Agenda Item #B. 318 00:57:17.390 --> 00:57:18.010 Planning Dept.: But 319 00:57:18.330 --> 00:57:22.890 Planning Dept.: you need a drawing of the whole building. Then, with the existing 320 00:57:23.040 --> 00:57:34.179 Planning Dept.: color scheme on the you know the neighbor's side that we can't talk to, and that band across the front, that architectural detail and lights, and 321 00:57:34.520 --> 00:57:41.839 Planning Dept.: all that contrast, that trim work, that all has to be maintained, how it is, and it I mean. 322 00:57:42.280 --> 00:57:45.289 Planning Dept.: in my opinion, that can't, that 323 00:57:45.960 --> 00:57:54.480 Planning Dept.: if it's painted it has to be a light color like a white, and that contrast that exists now has to be maintained. 324 00:57:56.310 --> 00:58:09.999 Planning Dept.: So the the right we have to give in fairness the applicant direction where the sign band, where the culture is now, that would be approximately the best you can match to the existing right side of the building. Is that what we're saying? 325 00:58:10.100 --> 00:58:13.499 Planning Dept.: And the everything else painted 326 00:58:13.540 --> 00:58:16.969 Planning Dept.: would match the color scheme on the right side, too. 327 00:58:17.050 --> 00:58:20.110 Planning Dept.: But there's no way to really make it half and half. 328 00:58:20.800 --> 00:58:28.160 Planning Dept.: Is that the direction we're giving? So the dark, because the the rest of that is painted, as you see here. You've got dark 329 00:58:28.550 --> 00:58:53.799 Planning Dept.: dirt trim on either side of the of the brackets on here continues all the way down and across. I mean, it's my my opinion might be worth a conversation with the people next door to say, Hey, we're redoing our side over here. Page 44 of 49 Agenda Item #B. Would you guys be amenable or opposed, or whatever to refurbish or paint? I I don't wanna make more work and spend more money, but it's it might be helpful for your case in terms of trying to get an overall. 330 00:58:54.450 --> 00:58:56.760 Planning Dept.: you know, right from the experience. 331 00:58:56.880 --> 00:58:59.369 Planning Dept.: Every time we try to do that kinda 332 00:58:59.490 --> 00:59:07.430 Planning Dept.: right. Remember that the next time they come to us they weren't very cooperative, all right. 333 00:59:08.490 --> 00:59:15.960 Planning Dept.: before we can even make any decision on anything. There has to be a drawing of the whole building all the detail. And then. 334 00:59:16.080 --> 00:59:21.779 Planning Dept.: if the paint colors that you suggested aren't white and gray, but maybe they're 335 00:59:21.830 --> 00:59:39.030 Planning Dept.: something else. But that contrast is maintained so that the details still pops. I don't know. Maybe that wouldn't look terrible, but it's really hard to to think about it when the drawing is so inaccurate for the facade like it doesn't have these lights. And then like that, it looks like it's a 336 00:59:39.040 --> 00:59:44.410 Planning Dept.: you know that one detail inside it looks like it's the end of the building. So 337 00:59:44.530 --> 00:59:48.659 Planning Dept.: that would be, I think, super helpful. And then I think that could be a quick. 338 00:59:48.820 --> 00:59:51.429 Planning Dept.: The conversation once all that's there. Yeah. 339 00:59:51.660 --> 00:59:56.229 Planning Dept.: if we could actually are we offering them the opportunity to give us 340 00:59:56.380 --> 01:00:07.540 Planning Dept.: an option? Which is one. The sign ban is painted as approximately as it can. I think we're we're focusing too much on the sign ban. I think it just well, if I may finish 341 01:00:07.690 --> 01:00:13.019 Planning Dept.: one option would be that the color that exists on the right half of the building, Jason, I mean. Page 45 of 49 Agenda Item #B. 342 01:00:13.290 --> 01:00:20.989 Planning Dept.: whether it's the sign band or the panels below the sill, the style rail rail panels. 343 01:00:21.050 --> 01:00:26.740 Planning Dept.: or the vertical trim that exists that's maintained on the left side of the building. 344 01:00:26.920 --> 01:00:30.129 Planning Dept.: That would be, I would imagine a default 345 01:00:31.475 --> 01:00:32.590 Planning Dept.: decision. 346 01:00:32.670 --> 01:00:41.559 Planning Dept.: And then to Catherine's Point. If there's another way of doing it, you could present it, and that possibly, if we see it 347 01:00:41.680 --> 01:00:45.689 Planning Dept.: with the other building next to it the other half. Then maybe we'll be swayed. 348 01:00:46.590 --> 01:00:53.380 Planning Dept.: I don't know if we've ever done that before, but I could see why. Not right? 349 01:00:53.510 --> 01:01:04.159 Planning Dept.: Because we want to get this, you know, we we certainly want the app to be able to come back in the most efficient way possible, so we don't have to come back again. And maybe, you know, somebody can persuade the other guy 350 01:01:04.240 --> 01:01:13.769 Planning Dept.: to, you know. Pay his half, too. But that's another matter of course. Alright. So then does that clarify it. So we're gonna ask for 351 01:01:15.080 --> 01:01:23.730 Planning Dept.: The lights to be kept on the facade and refurbish if necessary. The paint for the eastern half of the building is is the default. 352 01:01:25.318 --> 01:01:36.009 Planning Dept.: Proposition, if you want to call it that, and then there is an option for contrasting color, something new, but if we see it with the rest of the building we could make a decision with you. 353 01:01:36.110 --> 01:01:45.080 Planning Dept.: and then the new entry will have kick panels on the side lights, and there'll be details of the door. Was Page 46 of 49 Agenda Item #B. there anything else we'd like them to do 354 01:01:45.720 --> 01:01:53.559 Planning Dept.: I think that covers it? But if somebody and yeah, I said the details. So if you got that manny, and did you get that alright? 355 01:01:55.073 --> 01:02:08.219 Planning Dept.: So then we should adjourn this to the do we vote for that? A motion to adjourn to the November meeting, I think, would be unfortunate. Do I hear a motion to adjourn this to the November meeting. Make a motion. 356 01:02:08.760 --> 01:02:10.770 Planning Dept.: It's Jason. Yes, in second 357 01:02:11.300 --> 01:02:20.120 Planning Dept.: alright. So motion is passed. So we're gonna adjourn it. And I'm sure it'll get resolved next month. All right. Thank you. 358 01:02:29.750 --> 01:02:40.029 Planning Dept.: And I guess if you have a good evening. Thank you. And I look forward to going there. By the way, what kind of this? What's it gonna be surveyed 359 01:02:44.810 --> 01:02:49.910 Planning Dept.: like a mix of like? 360 01:02:50.020 --> 01:02:54.050 Planning Dept.: Yes, they got American Spanish group. Oh, okay. Good. 361 01:02:54.260 --> 01:02:55.070 Planning Dept.: great. 362 01:02:56.870 --> 01:03:01.679 Planning Dept.: alright Steve. I guess we've been able to make it. So we're not gonna be able to hear about 363 01:03:02.000 --> 01:03:05.469 Planning Dept.: his research. And the only other thing I'd like to just bring up 364 01:03:05.560 --> 01:03:16.040 Planning Dept.: is, you may have already seen an email. We have plenty of time to talk about this from Joyce Cole. Who was? It is our village historian. She was a member of Hpc. 365 01:03:16.180 --> 01:03:24.889 Planning Dept.: And she would like to make a presentation to us for her efforts to try to create a historic black district in Page 47 of 49 Agenda Item #B. Austin. We have 366 01:03:24.960 --> 01:03:29.429 Planning Dept.: a great deal of lineage in this community for them 367 01:03:29.779 --> 01:03:37.039 Planning Dept.: historical evidence of it. So I'd like to put it on the agenda for November. I could tell her she can. 368 01:03:37.170 --> 01:03:45.969 Planning Dept.: I don't. We don't know how many app, but we got one application at least. November, this one, and hopefully that one took a half hour. Probably take a half an hour, and then. 369 01:03:45.980 --> 01:03:49.298 Planning Dept.: you know, Steve's, if we don't have enough time for Steve's 370 01:03:49.790 --> 01:04:01.550 Planning Dept.: historic research and November meeting. We can always, if Steve was flexible, we can always talk about in December so ideally, then the agenda would be this application, plus any of others that would come up. 371 01:04:01.640 --> 01:04:05.249 Planning Dept.: I could invite Joyce to make a presentation to us. 372 01:04:05.300 --> 01:04:11.810 Planning Dept.: and see what she has in mind beyond what you may have already read, or you can like read in the email. I copied you. 373 01:04:12.040 --> 01:04:16.029 Planning Dept.: and if there's time remaining, of course, then we can listen to Steve. 374 01:04:16.260 --> 01:04:17.500 Planning Dept.: if that's okay. 375 01:04:18.200 --> 01:04:20.377 Planning Dept.: alright. And with all of that 376 01:04:21.070 --> 01:04:27.140 Planning Dept.: So I hear a motion to adjourn. I think, unless there's some other information or topics to bring up 377 01:04:28.090 --> 01:04:30.619 Planning Dept.: alright. Well, I hear a motion to adjourn. 378 Page 48 of 49 Agenda Item #B. 01:04:30.690 --> 01:04:40.894 Planning Dept.: You want to hear a motion to adjourn. Page 49 of 49