Historic District Commission
Regular MeetingChapel Hill, NC · July 20, 2021
Minutes
Town Hall
TOWN OF CHAPEL HILL 405 Martin Luther King Jr.
Boulevard
Historic District Commission Chapel Hill, NC 27514
Meeting Minutes
Chair David Schwartz Josh Gurlitz
Vice-Chair Duncan Lascelles Nancy McCormick
Deputy Vice-Chair Sean Murphy Anne Perl De Pal
Chris Berndt Polly Van de Velde
Brian Daniels
Tuesday, July 20, 2021 5:30 PM Virtual Meeting
Special Meeting - Revised Agenda
Virtual Meeting Notification
Board members will attend and participate in this meeting remotely, through internet
access, and will not physically attend. The Town will not provide a physical location
for viewing the meeting.
The public is invited to attend the Zoom webinar directly online or by phone.
Register for this webinar:
https://us02web.zoom.us/webinar/register/WN_m0ik8Bg_R3Si7iDklvTSbA. After
registering, you will receive a confirmation email containing information about joining
the webinar in listen-only mode. Phone: 301-715-8592, Meeting ID: 823 7703 8564.
Opening
Roll Call
Anya Grahn, Liaison to Commission, Charnika Harrell, Liaison to Commission,
and Brian Ferrell, Counsel to Commission
Present 8 - Chair David Schwartz, Vice-Chair Duncan Lascelles,
Deputy Vice-Chair Sean Murphy, Brian Daniels , Josh
Gurlitz, Nancy McCormick, Anne Perl De Pal , and Polly
Van de Velde
Excused 1 - Christine Berndt
Secretary reads procedures into the record
Commission Chair reads public charge
Approval of Agenda
Announcements
Page 1 of 10
Historic District Commission Meeting Minutes July 20, 2021
Chair Schwartz stated that review of Certificate of Appropriateness (COA)
applications would begin at 7pm.
Petitions
Historic District Design Principles & Standards
1. Historic District Design Principles & Standards - Photo [21-0493]
Replacement
Commissioner Gurlitz explained that a committee had reviewed possible photo
replacements to the Design Principles & Standards ("Design Standards"). He
presented photos and captions, explained the reasoning for replacement, and
then provided alternative photos for the Commission to consider.
Commissioner Lascelles joined the meeting at 5:49pm.
Gurlitz recommended deleting the photo on page 26 of the Design Standards
as the photo was an example of modern design not typically found in the
historic districts. A motion was made by Schwartz, seconded by Gurlitz, to
remove the photo and not replace it. The motion passed 5 to 3.
Gurlitz presented a photo on the top of page 54 and explained that the
committee wanted to retain this photo to encourage garage designs that are
subordinate in size and scale to the primary structure. There were no
objections.
Gurlitz explained that the photo on the bottom of page 54 of a 1.5-story, 2-car
garage was an inaccurate representation of early 20th century garages in the
district. The Commission discussed the history of garage development in the
historic districts, how to address photo captions, and the Commission's
interest in encouraging smaller garages. A motion was made by McCormick,
seconded by Daniels, to replace the photo with a photo depicting a one-story
garage. The motion failed by an action of 4 to 4.
Gurltiz pointed out that a photo on page 72 showed a house that had been
approved as part an appeal lawsuit. A motion was made by McCormick,
seconded by Van de Velde, to replace the photo. The motion carried by a
unanimous vote.
Gurlitz discussed a photo on page 85 showing a house of modern design. He
found that the proposed replacement photo of a contemporary house was a
Page 2 of 10
Historic District Commission Meeting Minutes July 20, 2021
better example. A motion was made by McCormick, seconded by Gurlitz. The
motion carried by a unanimous vote.
Gurlitz presented a photo on page 111 of a two-car garage on the side of the
house. He explained that the photo was misleading in that it appeared the
house was on the front of the house. He explained the challenge of the
caption. A motion was made by McCormick, seconded by Van de Velde, to
replace the photo with one of 521 Hooper Lane. The motion carried by a
unanimous vote.
Gurlitz described the photos on page 116 showing examples of new
construction that he found did not accurately illustrate the scale and
proportion of the majority of new and old homes in the district. The
Commission discussed that one house was in Gimghoul and had been
reconstructed to match the original. They thought it would be helpful to
include a photo depicting a house within the context of its neighborhood.
They discussed the formatting and layout of the page that would be
necessary to replace the photos. A motion was made by McCormick and
amended by Gurlitz to retain the top photo and replace the lower photo on the
page, and was seconded by Daniels. The motion carried by a vote of 6 to 2.
A motion was made by Gurlitz, seconded by Daniels, to replace the photo on
page 119. The motion carried by a unanimous vote.
Gurlitz discussed a photo and caption on page 128 of a new garage. He
provided an alternative photo of an accessory structure. The Commission
spoke of the history of the accessory structure in the proposed replacement
photograph and other examples of new garages in the historic districts. They
spoke of a photo on page 129 as a better example of a smaller garage
replacement. A motion was made by McCormick, seconded by Perl de Pal to
replace the photo on page 129 with a smaller garage. The motion carried by
a vote of 6 to 2.
Gurlitz found that replacement photos provided a better example of the
appropriate scale of additions than the photos included on page 132. The
Commission discussed the context of each addition shown and the visibility of
the additions from the right of way. A motion was made by
McCormick,amended by Daniels to remove both photos and replace with a
single photo. The motion was seconded by Perl de Pal and carried with a
vote of 5 to 3.
Page 3 of 10
Historic District Commission Meeting Minutes July 20, 2021
Gurlitz explained that community members had suggested replacing the photo
of new construction on the cover. There was interest in presenting examples
of smaller houses in the district. A motion was made by Gurlitz, seconded by
Daniels, to replace the photo with the recommended alternative photo. The
motion carried by a vote of 6 to 2.
Discussion
Fieldstone & Brick Walls
This item was continued to a date uncertain.
Council petition regarding Design Review Advisory Committee
This item was continued to a date uncertain.
Historic District Commission Rules of Procedure
2. Revisions to Historic District Commission Rules of Procedure [21-0373]
Ferrell, Counsel to the Commission, explained the proposed changes are
driven by recent amendments to the Land Use Management Ordinance and
North Carolina General Statutes 160D. He discussed with the Commission
state law requirements for consent from those with standing for a virtual
meeting. There were concerns about including a North Carolina Bar
Association opinion in the rules, and there was consensus for its removal.
They also considered who had the ability to represent property owners as an
agent.
The Commission continued the discussion to the September 14, 2021
meeting.
Continue to September 14, 2021
3. 6 Cobb Terrace [21-0497]
This item was continued to September 14, 2021.
Old Business (Starting at 7pm)
4. 104 N. Boundary Street [21-0624]
Grahn explained that the applicant proposed to construct a second floor
addition on the rear elevation of the house, replace several windows and
doors, and construct a new ADA ramp accessing the basement.
Commissioners disclosed that had walked or driven by the site.
Page 4 of 10
Historic District Commission Meeting Minutes July 20, 2021
Mark Wilson, project architect, introduced property owners, Derek and Louise
Winstanly. The Winstanlys spoke of their interest in aging in place in the
home. Wilson presented aerial photos of the site as well as photos of the
existing conditions and materials. He provided existing and proposed floor
plans, noting the proposed changes. He discussed the steps taken to meet
the Design Standards and Secretary of the Interior's Standards. He
requested an amendment to staff's proposed finding of fact 8 to clarify the
French doors, transom, and sidelights of the sun porch would be replaced.
The Commission considered the proposed changes. They discussed the
impacts of the addition on the view from the adjacent Horace Williams House.
They clarified that the existing stone sill would be reused to expand the
kitchen windows and that the shutters were cosmetic, not functional.
A motion was made by Murphy, seconded by Gurlitz, to approve the
Certificate of Appropriateness with the amendment to the finding of fact. The
motion carried by a unanimous vote.
5. 214 Glenburnie Street [21-0625]
Grahn stated the applicant proposed to renovate the historic house, construct
a two-story addition, and make site improvements. Commissioners disclosed
that they have walked or driven by the house. Schwartz and Perl de Pal said
they had visited the site.
Property owners Vickie Segar and Benjamin Gildin explained their intent to
renovate the house for a growing family. The discussed that the house
required new plumbing, electrical, and mold remediation.
Cari Paulus Filer, architect, outlined the history of the house including its
history of remodels and additions. She presented the proposed plans for the
new addition and explained how the design sought to reflect the original
building. She stated that the craftsmanship of the original masonry was poor
and required repair. The applicant proposed to paint the house to match the
new addition to avoid a patchy appearance and Paulus Filer provided
examples of historic buildings with mineral-based painted masonry. She
spoke to the need to remove an original chimney on the side elevation and to
construct a new entrance on the facade. She provided details of lighting
fixtures and half-round copper gutters.
Page 5 of 10
Historic District Commission Meeting Minutes July 20, 2021
The Commission discussed the need to paint the original unpainted masonry.
Commissioners found that the imperfections of the building were part of its
history and the Design Standards did not support painting masonry. Paulus
Filer explained the applicant wanted the house to look cohesive and the
painted appearance of the addition against the dark brick was a stark contrast
and would make the addition appear larger. The Commission found they had
no discretion to approve painting unpainted historic masonry.
The architect and Commission spoke of the scale and proportion of the new
elements and addition compared to the original house. Paulus Filer confirmed
that the applicants' team had not confirmed the existing rear addition was
historic, but that it was proposed to be removed. Commissioners spoke of the
size and placement of the additions, their visibility from the rights-of-way, and
whether they competed visually with the historic house. They considered
whether the additions complied with the Design Standards. They discussed
the roof ridge heights and whether the roof line of the additions could be
lowered from the historic ridges. Commissioners found that the new portico on
the facade did not comply with the Design Standards as it transformed the
front of the house and the new door was much larger in scale than the
original.
John Sweet, neighbor, explained that the property owners had worked closely
with the neighbors to resolve concerns about the existing trees. Paulus Filer
asked the Commission to incorporate recommended stipulations based on the
conversations with the neighbors.
Susan Smith, community member, stated she had visited the site and was
interested in the amount of brick repair that was required. She shared the
Commission's concerns regarding the size of the addition overpowering the
house, changes to the entryway, and painting the historic masonry.
Guy Meilleur, arborist, explained he had been hired by the property owners.
He supported the agreement with the neighbors to protect the trees.
Commissioners and David Swanson, landscape architect, discussed the
importance of maintaining open space and the open character of the district.
Sweet found that a large house on a large lot was in keeping with the historic
district than a large house on a small lot. He supported locating the mass of
the new addition behind the house where it was less impactful to neighbors.
Bob Epting, attorney for the neighbors, stated that the proposed stipulations
Page 6 of 10
Historic District Commission Meeting Minutes July 20, 2021
met the neighbors' objectives. He was happy that the design had been
amended to protect the large specimen oak trees on the property.
The Commission summarized their concerns for the removal of the chimney,
painting the brick, changing the front door and portico, and the height of the
roof ridge on the rear addition. They discussed the dormers on the side
addition. Some expressed concern about the size of the addition and its
connection with the rear roofline of the historic house. They asked the
applicant to consider design strategies that would reduce the visual impact of
the additions. Others spoke about ways the additions could be made
secondary and different from the main structure. All Commissioners agreed
that the additions would be more congruent with the district character if they
were smaller in size. They requested the applicant to return with calculations
on the square footage and dimensions of the portion of the house to be
demolished and the new addition.
The Commission discussed calling a special meeting in August to hear only
this item and directed staff to survey Commissioners for their availability. A
motion was made Gurlitz, seconded by Van de Velde, to continue the item to
September 14, 2021. The motion carried by a unanimous vote.
The application would be renoticed if the Commission was able to meet in
August.
6. 514 E. Rosemary Street [21-0617]
Grahn explained that the applicant proposed adding a new generator on the
west side of the house and constructing a new metal fence to enclose the
backyard.
Commissioners disclosed that they had walked and driven by the site.
Bill Raynor, property owner, explained that the house was in the middle of
construction. He stated that the stone wall ran along the shared property line
with his neighbor and he proposed constructing a metal fence to replace a
dilapidated wood fence. He spoke of security and pet containment issues that
necessitated a fence. He spoke of the generator's placement and
requirements for ventilation. He and the commission discussed whether the
generator complied with the Town's noise ordinance. Raynor explained that
evergreen shrubs would be planted to mitigate the view of the generator from
the street.
Page 7 of 10
Historic District Commission Meeting Minutes July 20, 2021
Commissioners discussed the fence height. They considered whether a
5-foot-tall metal fence in the side yard complied with the Design Standards
which required front yard fences to generally be no more than 30 inches in
height. Some found that the replacement fence should be wood to match
what was there while others thought that a wood fence was in conflict with the
open character of the historic districts.
A motion was made by Lascelles, amended and seconded by Schwartz, to
approve the Certificate of Appropriateness with a condition that landscaping
be used to screen the generator. The motion carried with a vote of 7 to 1.
Aye: 7 - Chair David Schwartz, Vice-Chair Duncan Lascelles, Deputy
Vice-Chair Sean Murphy, Brian Daniels , Josh Gurlitz, Anne
Perl De Pal , and Polly Van de Velde
Nay: 1 - Nancy McCormick
Excused: 1 - Christine Berndt
New Business
7. 150 E. Rosemary Street [21-0633]
Grahn explained that the project proposed creating a park behind the Post
Office Building. Commissioners disclosed that they had walked by and were
familiar with the site. Murphy noted he had previously worked with the project
architect, Michael Stevenson, but it would not impact his decision making.
Schwartz stated he had visited the site and participated in the review of the
concept plan.
Joe Dye, Grubb Properties, explained that this site was part of an economic
development agreement between Grubb and the Town of Chapel Hill. He
stated that as part of the development agreement, his firm would be
developing the park to deliver to the Town.
Michael Stevenson, project architect, presented site plans and photographs to
explain the context, location, and existing conditions. He described the
concrete wall that wraps most of the site and discussed some of the public
improvements proposed, including the removal of two public parking spaces
to create wider sidewalks that included street trees. He spoke of the need to
straighten NCNB alley to improve pedestrian activity on the site. He
discussed the requirements of an OWASA easement that required design
Page 8 of 10
Historic District Commission Meeting Minutes July 20, 2021
solutions in terms of plantings and removable improvements. He described
the inspiration for the proposed materials, including pre-cast concrete similar
in color and finish to the limestone details of the Post Office, concrete paving,
red brick, and Chapel Hill grit.
The Commission discussed the proposed materials and the programming for
the park. Commissioners spoke of the need to create taller canopy and
shade trees. There was interest in ensuring that the proposed fieldstone
walls would have a natural stone finish rather than a squared, chiseled
finished edge and dry-stacked appearance. There was support for the
straightening of the alleyway, but concern that its termination on Henderson
Street may create visibility issues. Some commissioners found that the site
was a transitional area between the commercial district and the historic
district. They recommended creating a stronger signal that it was the
entrance to the historic district and requested more traditional use of
materials, particularly along the north edge of the site, similar to those found
in the historic district.
A motion was made by Gurlitz, seconded by Schwartz, to approve the
realignment of the alleyway. The motion carried by a unanimous vote.
A motion was made by Perl de Pal, seconded by Daniels, to continue the item
to the September 14, 2021 meeting. The motion carried by a unanimous vote.
The Commission recommended the applicant consider creating a more
organic design that is not hindered by stone walls and use more stone on the
seat walls.
Adjournment
Next Meeting - September 14, 2021
Page 9 of 10
Historic District Commission Meeting Minutes July 20, 2021
Order of Consideration of Agenda Items:
1. Staff Presentation
2. Applicant’s Presentation
3. Public Comment
4. Board Discussion
5. Motion
6. Restatement of Motion by Chair
7. Vote
8. Announcement of Vote by Chair
Public Charge: The Advisory Body pledges its respect to the public. The
Body asks the public to conduct themselves in a respectful, courteous
manner, both with the Body and with fellow members of the public.
Should any member of the Body or any member of the public fail to
observe this charge at any time, the Chair will ask the offending
person to leave the meeting until that individual regains personal
control. Should decorum fail to be restored, the Chair will recess the
meeting until a genuine commitment to this public charge is observed.
Unless otherwise noted, please contact the Planning Department at
919-968-2728; planning@townofchapelhill.org for more information on
the above referenced applications.
See the Advisory Boards page http://www.townofchapelhill.org/boards
for background information on this Board.
Page 10 of 10
Agenda
Town Hall
TOWN OF CHAPEL HILL 405 Martin Luther King Jr.
Boulevard
Historic District Commission Chapel Hill, NC 27514
Meeting Agenda
Chair David Schwartz Josh Gurlitz
Vice-Chair Duncan Lascelles Nancy McCormick
Deputy Vice-Chair Sean Murphy Anne Perl De Pal
Chris Berndt Polly Van de Velde
Brian Daniels
Tuesday, July 20, 2021 5:30 PM Virtual Meeting
Special Meeting - Revised Agenda
Virtual Meeting Notification
Opening
Roll Call
Secretary reads procedures into the record
Commission Chair reads public charge
Approval of Agenda
Announcements
Petitions
Historic District Design Principles & Standards
1. Historic District Design Principles & Standards - Photo [21-0493]
Replacement
Attachments: Staff Memo
Commissioner Josh Gurlitz Edits
Commissioner Nancy McCormick Edits
Chair Schwartz Edits
Photo Replacement Summarized
Recommendations
http://www.townofchapelhill.org Page 1 of 3 Printed on 7/14/2021
Historic District Commission Meeting Agenda July 20, 2021
Discussion
Fieldstone & Brick Walls
Council petition regarding Design Review Advisory Committee
Historic District Commission Rules of Procedure
2. Revisions to Historic District Commission Rules of [21-0373]
Procedure
Attachments: Staff Memo
Draft Rules of Procedure
Continue to September 14, 2021
3. 6 Cobb Terrace [21-0497]
Attachments: Staff Memo
Application Materials
Old Business (Starting at 7pm)
4. 104 N. Boundary Street [21-0624]
Attachments: Staff Memo
Application Materials
5. 214 Glenburnie Street [21-0625]
Attachments: Staff Memo
Application Materials - Part I
Application Materials - Part II
6. 514 E. Rosemary Street [21-0617]
Attachments: Staff Memo
Application Materials
New Business
7. 150 E. Rosemary Street [21-0633]
http://www.townofchapelhill.org Page 2 of 3 Printed on 7/14/2021
Historic District Commission Meeting Agenda July 20, 2021
Attachments: Staff Memo
Application Materials
Adjournment
Order of Consideration of Agenda Items:
1. Staff Presentation
2. Applicant’s Presentation
3. Public Comment
4. Board Discussion
5. Motion
6. Restatement of Motion by Chair
7. Vote
8. Announcement of Vote by Chair
Public Charge: The Advisory Body pledges its respect to the public. The Body
asks the public to conduct themselves in a respectful, courteous manner, both
with the Body and with fellow members of the public. Should any member of the
Body or any member of the public fail to observe this charge at any time, the
Chair will ask the offending person to leave the meeting until that individual
regains personal control. Should decorum fail to be restored, the Chair will
recess the meeting until a genuine commitment to this public charge is observed.
Unless otherwise noted, please contact the Planning Department at
919-968-2728; planning@townofchapelhill.org for more information on the
above referenced applications.
See the Advisory Boards page http://www.townofchapelhill.org/boards for
background information on this Board.
http://www.townofchapelhill.org Page 3 of 3 Printed on 7/14/2021
Get email alerts for Chapel Hill
A daily email when new agendas and minutes are posted.