City Council Strategic Planning Meeting - ARCHIVED
Regular MeetingSouth Jordan, UT · November 8, 2023
Minutes
SOUTH JORDAN CITY
CITY COUNCIL STATEGIC PLANNING MEETING
November 8, 2023
Present: Mayor Dawn R. Ramsey, Council Member Patrick Harris, Council Member Brad
Marlor, Council Member Don Shelton, Council Member Tamara Zander, Council
Member Jason McGuire, City Manager Dustin Lewis, Assistant City Manager
Jason Rasmussen, City Attorney Ryan Loose, Director of Commerce Brian
Preece, Director of Strategy & Budget Don Tingey, Strategy & Budget Analyst
Abagail Patonai, Associate Director of Strategy & Budget Katie Olson, Fire Chief
Chris Dawson, Director of Administrative Services Melinda Seager, Director of
Public Works Raymond Garrison, Director of Recreation Janell Payne, CFO Sunil
Naidu, Director of Planning Steven Schaefermeyer, Deputy City Engineer Jeremy
Nielson, Police Chief Jeff Carr, Human Resources Director Teresa Cook, IT
Director Jon Day, City Recorder Anna Crookston
Absent:
Others: Laurel Bevans
5:16 P.M.
STRATEGIC PLANNING MEETING
A. Welcome, Roll Call, and Introduction: By Mayor Dawn R. Ramsey
Mayor Ramsey welcomed everyone present and introduced the meeting.
B. Invocation: By Director of Strategy & Budget, Don Tingey
Director Tingey offered the invocation.
C. Dinner Served
D. Discussion: Strategic Priorities, Revised Strategic Goals and Objectives, and future
action items for Fiscal Year 2024-25.
City Manager Dustin Lewis reviewed the planned discussion topics for the meeting tonight,
including future projects and setting the council schedule for next year. Regarding that schedule,
he asked to discuss meeting only once in April to allow for council members and staff to attend
the Utah League of Cities and Towns meeting.
The council agreed to remove the April 16 meeting.
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Manager Lewis also asked if the council would like staff to schedule any combined meetings
with the Planning Commission. The council agreed they would like to schedule two combined
meetings, during work sessions, for the upcoming year.
Council Member Zander joined the meeting.
Manager Lewis then moved on to discuss the municipal courts and the possibility of legislation
from the state to change the courts. He shared the city’s research on the cost of those courts, the
associated revenue streams, etc. It works out to a negative amount, costing the city money to
have the municipal courts at the cost of about $500,000 a year. The potential options for changes
are to remove the municipal court, which requires notice being given and some associated costs.
The city can keep the court as it is, or they can wait and see what the legislature decides to do in
regards to possibly taking them over in the future. If the city removes the municipal court they
will probably need to keep an administrative hearing officer for code complaints and cases, etc.
They would also need to employ the prosecutors in the office of the city attorney because cases
would still have to prosecuted, just in a different court location. At the last city manager meeting
he attended with The League, the topic came up and it was asked how many in attendance were
considering removing their municipal courts, and nearly every hand in the room went up. The
city is due for court recertification at the next council meeting on December 5, and he explained
that not recertifying was not a viable option for removing the municipal court. His
recommendation is to give strong consideration to ceasing the city’s municipal court. The
process for that is long and requires about a year and a half.
Council Member McGuire asked where those cases go if the municipal court is gone.
City Attorney Ryan Loose explained that they would most likely go to the county justice court,
and throughout the transition an agreement would be made with neighboring cities to fill in. He
also mentioned the judge’s term having a part in the timing of that decision since the city still has
to pay the judge for their entire term. If the judge is allowed to run for re-election then the city
would be responsible for the next six year term, even if the courts are closed. Our city’s judge is
up for election in two years, and the closure is a two year process. There would be increased
costs with our prosecutors having to travel to other courts after the closure, but an agreement
with a neighboring city would help with some of those costs, keeping them closer to home. Chief
Carr’s officers would have to go to other courts to testify, which would be an additional cost.
The state is discussing pulling all B & C misdemeanors out of the municipal courts, moving
them to the district courts, leaving basically traffic and other infractions for the municipal courts.
If all our courts were doing was traffic and other infractions, we would not be operating as a full-
time court, while still paying the judge and staff for full-time work.
Manager Lewis expressed his wish to do this early if the city chooses to make those changes,
before a lot of other cities make the same announcement and the state decides to change their
mind due to the increased burden on them.
Council Member Marlor asked if closing the courts would cause a positive net effect on the
budget in the end.
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Attorney Loose said he believes so since we do not have to have a court, it currently runs in the
red, and even with the additional costs of staff having to travel after a closure it still wouldn’t be
as bad as the current losses. In addition, the Public Safety Building would gain additional space
from those areas being closed. Well over half the tickets being written in the city are for non-
residents, so keeping a court here isn’t necessarily benefitting the majority of the residents here.
Mayor Ramsey asked to draw attention to the fact that the courts are only servicing 30% of our
residents; specifically that residents are only 30% of those being ticketed and utilizing the local
court system. The current system isn’t even serving 30% of all our residents, only those involved
in legal issues.
Attorney Loose confirmed that of those being served by the court, only 30% of the traffic cases
are residents of the city. There are other legal issues like shoplifting that encompass a slightly
higher percentage, but he also pointed out that most of our “through” streets are used by non-
residents passing through to get to another destination.
Manager Lewis then moved on to discuss potentially new programs that have been mentioned in
the past year. First was the Urban Deer Mitigation Program. Several residents have shared
concerns about the deer in their yards. The city’s team has met with the DWR, animal control
and looked at programs in other areas; most of which are no longer in practice due to changes in
rules. If the program is implemented, it is overseen by the state with certain specific rules. The
city would have to pay to get tags from DNR, pay someone to harvest the animal in its current
location and do it in a humane fashion, disembowel the animal, take it to be processed and
donated to food banks, etc. After looking at the program, it was determined it would require a
full time employee. There are very few cities with these kinds of programs anymore due to the
extensive rules and costs. His recommendation to the council is not to implement the program
based on staff’s extensive research. The next program was the Healthy South Jordan Program.
Staff has looked at the requirements and application process for the program and award,
including recertification, and his recommendation was to pursue the program and make it an
official city program. Many of the requirements are already being met by the city’s current
programming, so the costs would be minimal. The next program discussed was the use of credit
cards by developers for their fees, which are large amounts, and the costs to the city for allowing
that. Staff has discussed ways to pass those costs back to the developers and his recommendation
is to direct staff to go ahead with passing those costs back. So far, the council has decided to hold
off on a decision for the courts, said no to the Urban Deer Mitigation Program, yes to the Healthy
South Jordan Program, and yes to passing the costs of using a credit card for convenience back to
the developers.
CFO Sunil Naidu gave some more details on implementing the credit card fee program. This
would not apply to residents paying their bills through a credit card, only to
contractors/developers paying their fees.
Manager Lewis moved on to discuss the possibility of an auto and plate detection system for the
police department to implement that works with neighboring police departments who use the
same technology. This is technology that puts cameras on poles in various locations in the city,
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and those cameras can be programmed to look for specific types of vehicles with specific details
to aid in solving crimes or finding criminals on the run. These cameras are only looking at the
rear plates of the vehicles as well, and they are not used for enforcement. They can be used to
help with Amber or senior alerts, as well as establishing leads for detectives of consistent travel
patterns of wanted individuals. The council and staff discussed potential costs and details, as well
as the other communities currently using the technology.
Police Chief Jeff Carr indicated there are some grant opportunities out there.
Manager Lewis also added they are researching whether or not restricted funds coming on for
law enforcement can be used for this program. Right now he is just wondering if the council is
interested in the concept or not. The next issue discussed was the high levels of police response
to car break-ins and residents requiring a police report to file an insurance claim. The technology
now exists to have a “digital officer” for those needing to report crimes like that to use their
phone, computer or kiosk at city buildings to get that police report. If in the line of questioning
from the computer it’s determined that the report is life threatening or an officer is needed right
away, it has the capability to turn that call over to VECC and generate an officer response. Not
only does this increase the service level for the residents, but it avoids tying up all those officers
and the need for additional officers and vehicles.
Chief Carr added that the city currently has a form that can be filled out online, but that form
goes to the sergeants who still have to have an officer contact the victim and fill things out the
old fashioned way. Many times people are just waiting for a case number, and our department
currently does about 600 of those online requests a year without advertising the ability to the
general public. He believes they will not only save money on the officers, but also on the
dispatch side. Once this system is ready, dispatch can share it with callers and send them over to
the online system. Officers will still respond if requested, but this could potentially save the city
one full officer and the associated benefits and costs.
Manager Lewis added that the software also allows users to choose the avatar of their digital
officer, which could help make residents feel more comfortable being able to choose the gender
or race of their officer. The system is also multilingual, which avoids issues with language
barriers. The council agreed to have staff explore the program and integrate it into the budget.
The next item to discuss was a parking division, is the city going to get into the area of parking
enforcement. There are already sections of the city where parking is by permit only, but there
isn’t currently a good mechanism to enforce that. As parking structures are added to the city, the
opportunities will be given for the city to own or be a part of that infrastructure. Staff has looked
into solutions for these problems, and there are many options. The city needs to decide if they
want to be in the parking business in the future, and if so, the foundation needs to be laid starting
now as it will require additional hiring and funding of the operational and maintenance costs. He
doesn’t need a yes or no today, but he needs to know if there is potentially any interest. Staff
shared some of their research and highlighted important information, including feedback from
other cities based on their experiences.
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Council Members Zander, Shelton, McGuire shared they were not interested in getting into the
parking business.
Manager Lewis moved on to discussing an invitation to the Montessori school down by the river
to work on a community garden.
Assistant City Manager Jason Rasmussen shared his insight on the project and what would be
involved. A piece of city park property was identified by the school for this project. The school
is willing to put a fence around it and do the leg work. Staff looked into it, and the city could
allow them to lease the land for a small amount and period of time, with terms including
rerouting any city sprinkler pipe. The city would not take on any of those costs, and would not be
watering it. Regarding any public benefit, the school offered to have gardening classes for the
community and residents, allowing them to come in and learn proper techniques. Staff felt that
was a pretty good offer for the small piece of land, and recommends entering into an agreement
to allow them to use the requested land.
Manager Lewis noted that the agreement would be written such that if the garden goes into
disrepair the school would have to return it to its original state at their own expense. He moved
on to discuss the city’s recreation program, including their partnership with Bingham Baseball.
After discussions with Bingham Baseball’s leader, Dan Ramsey, it was shared that he is getting
ready to retire and staff has been working with him on plans for the future. Manager Lewis
proposed the city work to transition from having a partner provide that aspect of programming to
the city providing it. The city would then run baseball like they do softball currently. Mr.
Ramsey kindly offered to stay on during another baseball season to help make that transition, if
the council would like to head in that direction. With the Bees Baseball Team making South
Jordan their home, this could be an opportunity to capitalize on that and continue making
baseball part of our identity. The baseball fields were turned over to the teams this year for
maintenance, and that didn’t work out as well as planned. He proposed taking the field
maintenance back next year, and look to transitioning being the little league provider of baseball;
along with taking it to a whole new level, run as a city program, and making it a premier
recreation program. He discussed the associated budget costs, and that the city would also take
over the concessions portion of the program, which is an additional revenue stream. This would
also allow for community partnerships/sponsorships. The council discussed their thoughts on the
potential program change. One benefit to this change is that competition for field use between
comp teams and the little league teams would disappear, as the city programs would get priority
on those fields.
Mayor Ramsey shared that Dan has been a volunteer all these years, and he can’t run it by
himself any longer. There is no one willing to take over, and the Ramseys are willing to donate
all the equipment they currently have as it was purchased privately by them.
Council Member Zander asked about the potential return on investment for little league baseball.
Manager Lewis responded that the city runs many programs that cost money in the end, and gave
Summerfest as an example. He doesn’t know this little league would ever generate money for the
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general fund, but the goal is to hopefully cover the costs. The city has many more resources
available to them for funding that a private citizen doesn’t, and they are hoping that will help
them cover their costs. If the council is interested, he can have staff look more into this and get
details on potential costs. He also discussed why the concessions at Mulligans doesn’t generate
profit, versus a concession stand at little league games. He discussed with the council that
baseball fields do take a lot of work to maintain, but there are a lot of passionate people in the
city who want to see this succeed. As they begin to put together Capital Improvement Projects
for the year, he wanted to bring up three specific projects which will need to be factored into the
budget in the near future; those are Fire Station 65, Water Tanks 7B and 8B, and the Public
Works West Facility.
CFO Naidu discussed options for bonding to complete those projects, noting that interest rates
are currently not doing very well. He will need to start working through the process and planning
soon, and discussed the funds needed for those projects, along with what funds have already
been allocated.
Council Member Shelton asked about seeing the specific numbers before discussing raising
taxes.
Mayor Ramsey discussed potential other funding tools that are becoming available, specifically
potentially available low interest loans for infrastructure in areas opening up land for
development. The League is still working on getting those ideas passed, and they still wouldn’t
be enough for what is needed. She then asked about any other funding mechanisms available.
CFO Naidu discussed some of the options the city has used in the past, and what could be
available to them in a little bit to help with those projects.
Council Member Harris asked about options with developers the city has relationships with.
Manager Lewis responded that would be a topic for another night with the City Attorney’s
Office.
Council Member Marlor asked if CFO Naidu was predicting a Truth in Taxation in 2024.
CFO Naidu responded that they have looked at past rates, but based on the statistics he has seen
the majority of Americans have dipped into their savings recently. The city needs money, but so
do the residents. As much as he’d like to ask to raise taxes, he doesn’t feel that he can. However,
if every request needs to be funded, then raising taxes would be the only option.
Council Member Harris thinks the reality is that things are more expensive now, but he also
agrees that the city needs to continue being conservative and careful.
Director Tingey noted that construction costs have also skyrocketed, giving examples of
construction costs for neighboring city projects.
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Council Member Zander asked if the city ever negotiated the land for the additional public works
yard being given to the city.
Manager Lewis responded yes that land has been given to the city. The estimated costs for all
three projects does not include a land cost because that was taken care of in the past and donated
to the city. He shared that the compensation committee has met, the directors have all submitted
their requests for new staffing. They are currently working through all that, and with the
information shared tonight by the council they can better address those requests with the budget
in mind. Staff will come back to the next budget meeting with all of that put together to fill in
gaps, and that is currently planned for the last week in January.
Council Member Zander shared that she thinks we are in hard times right now. She has a team
staff of 20 people and they are releasing two of them this week; that is not fun, and is a huge
decrease in her staff. She suggested looking into to more AI, which is what she has started doing
in her business to help.
Manager Lewis responded that they have had those discussions, but there isn’t much more he can
get out of city employees; many of whom are at their breaking point and that’s the reason they
are asking for more. Many staff are doing the jobs of more than one FTE. He understands what
she is saying, and the directors can confirm that he has pushed every efficiency possible; to the
point of people working across departments to get stuff done. He knows the requests this year are
bare bones, and they will have to whittle that down.
Council Member McGuire noted that every year the council asks staff to do more, but they aren’t
hiring people at the same rate.
Manager Lewis added that there has also been more development, which results in more
sidewalks, parks, streets, etc., that need to be maintained. If the growth in the city was stagnant,
things would be different.
Council Member Zander asked again if we had looked at every possibility of using AI to help.
Manager Lewis responded yes that is why Chief Carr presented the digital officer option. Being
in a service industry, many time the only option is boots on the streets getting stuff done.
Council Member Zander doesn’t want to sterilize the experience, but they do need to ask how
they expand each individual’s abilities with AI included.
Manager Lewis noted that the city also has really good employees, so much so that other entities
are trying to poach them all the time, and he referenced the streets manager that was lost
yesterday to the private sector. He takes it very seriously, looking at that cost of living
adjustment, to make sure they can compensate those employees, and the merit to reward the
people working so hard and adding additional skills. Many employees have taken the initiative to
learn new skills, allowing them to add more work to their day, and he can’t burn them out. Salt
Lake County announced they are having a hiring freeze, he is watching very closely to see what
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other cities are doing in that realm. We have worked so hard to have a competitive workforce
and he doesn’t want the city to lose any ground because it’s so hard to get caught up.
Council Member Zander agreed, noting that once the staff is trained it is so hard to bring on new
employees and get them up to speed.
Mayor Ramsey noted that the last part of this meeting has made her thoughts about the court
easier to sort out. If they are losing $500,000 a year on courts and they can cut the court without
taking away service, the conversation changes for her. She has the same thoughts for the credit
card fees.
E. Summarize Next Steps: Fiscal Year 2024-25 Strategic Planning and Budget.
Council Member Shelton motioned to adjourn the November 8, 2023 City Council
Strategic Planning Meeting. Council Member Marlor seconded the motion; vote was 5-0
unanimous in favor.
The November 8, 2023 City Council Strategic Planning Meeting adjourned at 7:18 p.m.
This is a true and correct copy of the November 8, 2023 City Council Strategic Planning
Meeting Minutes, which were approved on December 5, 2023.
South Jordan City Recorder
Agenda
CITY OF SOUTH JORDAN
CITY COUNCIL STRATEGIC PLANNING
MEETING AGENDA
CITY COUNCIL WORK ROOM
WEDNESDAY, NOVEMBER 8, 2023 5:00 p.m.
Notice is hereby given that the South Jordan City Council will hold a Strategic Planning Meeting on
Wednesday, November 8, 2023, in the City Council Work Room, located at 1600 W. Towne Center Drive,
South Jordan, Utah. Persons with disabilities who may need assistance should contact the City Recorder
at least 24 hours prior to this meeting.
Strategic Planning Meeting Agenda:
A. Welcome, Roll Call, and Introduction: By Mayor, Dawn R. Ramsey
B. Invocation: By Director of Strategy & Budget, Don Tingey
C. Dinner Served
D. Discussion: Strategic Priorities, Revised Strategic Goals and Objectives, and future action items
for Fiscal Year 2024-25.
E. Summarize Next Steps: Fiscal Year 2024-25 Strategic Planning and Budget.
ADJOURNMENT
CERTIFICATE OF POSTING
STATE OF UTAH )
COUNTY OF SALT LAKE )
I, Anna Crookston, the duly appointed City Recorder of South Jordan City, Utah, certify that the
foregoing City Council Agenda was emailed to at least one newspaper of general circulation within the
geographic jurisdiction of the public body. The agenda was also posted at the principal office of the public
body and also posted on the Utah State Public Notice Website http://www.utah.gov/pmn/index.html and
on South Jordan City’s website at www.sjc.utah.gov. Published and posted November 7, 2023.
City Council Strategic Planning Meeting – November 8, 2023
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